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Hacking for UFO secrets
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MythopoeikaOffline
I am a meat popsicle
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PostPosted: 22-07-2010 21:39    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kondoru wrote:
Mythopoeika, hes no computer geek.

and neither am I

Im only here because I spent years in conditioning myself to look at a screen


Gary McKinnon is an ex-system administrator. So yes, he's a computer geek.

What does your last sentence mean? Not sure I follow.
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Pietro_Mercurios
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PostPosted: 30-11-2010 10:18    Post subject: Reply with quote

Something to really write to your MP about?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/nov/30/wikileaks-cables-gary-mckinnon-gordon-brown

More writhing worms revealed by Wikileaks can opener.
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Quake42Offline
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PostPosted: 30-11-2010 14:57    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
More writhing worms revealed by Wikileaks can opener.


Again, no huge surprise. Brown raised McKinnon's case, the US were not sympathetic because of Al-Megrahi. I'm not sure what there is to write to your MP about.
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Pietro_Mercurios
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PostPosted: 30-11-2010 16:29    Post subject: Reply with quote

Time to tear up an extradition treaty that only favours the USA, perhaps? Last year, even the Daily Telegraph and the Tories thought so.
Quote:
Link:
Daily Telegraph (19/07/2009):

Time to Show How Flawed the US - UK Extradition Treaty Really Is.


Although Gary McKinnon is known as a computer hacker, just a vulnerable man with no axe to grind for UK plc, his case may lead to changes that the CBI and others have been seeking for British businesses since the fallout from the NatWest Three case showed the unfairness in the UK-US extradition arrangements.

Daily Telegraph. By Louise Delahunty 8:00PM BST 19 Jul 2009

On July 15, the Conservative Party tabled a vote on the McKinnon case, calling for the reform of the Extradition Act 2003. Chris Grayling, shadow home secretary, called for a review of extradition laws with the US, stating "I believe such a review is vital to maintain the integrity of our extradition system," and, about the law, "We were told that it was a move to address the international security situation after the horrendous incidents of 2001," before concluding, "The people actually being extradited are not actually the people we were told, in the first place, it was designed for."

The vote was lost but the debate was helpful in summarising how this law came about, with even Government ministers admitting the imbalance.

...

Isn't the only sort of international relationship that favours one way extradition treaties, is that between the conquering power and the conquered subject nation?
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Quake42Offline
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PostPosted: 30-11-2010 16:44    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Time to tear up an extradition treaty that only favours the USA, perhaps?


Yep, the treaty as it stands should be renegotiated so as to treat extradition requests from both parties to it equally.

That said, and as I've said earlier in this thread, there seems to be a great deal of spinning on behalf of McKinnon. He was offered a reasonable deal and refused to take it. The claims of "60 years in a supermax facility" seem to be an invention of his legal team, who are relying on rather dubious medical reasons as to why he should be treated as a special case.

I don't want McKinnon to suffer either, but I do think that the coverage of this in the UK media has been extraordinarily one-sided.
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Quake42Offline
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PostPosted: 18-07-2011 13:58    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anyone know what is happening with this story? It seems to have been radio silence for over six months.
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KondoruOffline
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PostPosted: 19-07-2011 20:18    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes.

Mythpoeka; I have always had great difficulty in watching things move on screens. (And mirrors worry me too)
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titchOffline
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PostPosted: 21-07-2011 14:31    Post subject: Reply with quote

My local paper covers the Mc Kinnon a lot, this is the latest http://edition.pagesuite-professional.co.uk/launch.aspx?referral=other&refresh=6Xt1b90H2Jz1&PBID=e351633c-ff08-4cf3-8bc5-6765249a1cae&skip= you have to skip to page 4 for the story , but basically the local MP has asked Cameron whats going on and he replied the home secretary is reviewing the medical evidence.So no movement really.
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titchOffline
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PostPosted: 27-10-2011 10:13    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is from my local paper, still no movement.
THE Home Secretary Theresa May has refused to say when she will decide whether to block the extradition of computer hacker Gary McKinnon.

Mr McKinnon admitted hacking into 97 US military computers in 2001 and 2002 and American prosecutors want to bring him to the United States to face errorism charges.

Mrs May, who was at the Lee Valley White Water Centre to discuss the security arrangements for next year’s Olympic Games, said the Home Office was still looking at the evidence surrounding Mr McKinnon’s case.

The 45-year-old from Palmers Green suffers from Asperger’s syndrome and his lawyers argue that sending him to the US to face prosecution would be a breach of the Human Rights Act.

Civil liberties campaigners also claim that the extradition treaty that the UK agreed with the US in 2003 favours the Americans, who do not have to provide any evidence that a crime has been committed before extradition can go ahead.

In contrast, the British authorities need to provide at least some evidence of a crime.
However, last week a judge-led report by Lord Justice Scott Baker concluded that the treaty was fair.

Mrs May said: “The review of the extradition treaty arrangements is a supporting piece of work but Scott Baker’s panel reviewed not just the US/UK treaty but also the treaty arrangements with Europe.

“We will look at it very carefully. I’ll be looking at what has come out and will respond to it in due course.”

The Home Office is also currently reviewing medical evidence surrounding Mr McKinnon’s condition and Mrs May has asked for a government-appointed psychiatrist, who is not an expert in Asperger’s, to examine him.

His family argue that only an expert in Mr McKinnon’s condition should see him but Mrs May said: “We have been talking with Mr McKinnon’s representatives and at the moment it is with our medical advisers.

“I have done what I think is right and asked the advice of the chief medical officer.”
Gary’s mother Janis Sharp said she hoped there would be a decision soon and added: “This Christmas will be the tenth Christmas since this began and he has never been able to enjoy one of those.

“We are really hoping that Theresa May will allow Gary to have a good Christmas for the first time in ten years.”
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Heckler20Offline
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PostPosted: 27-10-2011 14:53    Post subject: Reply with quote

titch wrote:
to the United States to face errorism charges.


Errorism? "Honestly officer it was a mistake", "Aha, you are under arrest for errorism!" Very Happy
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titchOffline
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PostPosted: 27-10-2011 15:53    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Enfield advertiser will be next to face errorism charges!!
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KondoruOffline
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PostPosted: 27-10-2011 15:58    Post subject: Reply with quote

He has admitted computer hacking...Surely that is evidence for a crime?
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rynner2Offline
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PostPosted: 31-10-2011 21:43    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gary McKinnon's extradition case must not be allowed to stumble on
America may feel bolstered in the wake of the Baker review, but Gary McKinnon deserves to be tried in the correct jurisdiction
Duncan Campbell guardian.co.uk, Monday 31 October 2011 19.30 GMT

This week, the Conservative MP Dominic Raab, with the backing of Labour's Keith Vaz and the Lib Dems' Sir Menzies Campbell, will try to win a full Commons debate on Britain's extradition laws. It could not come at a more pertinent time for Gary McKinnon, the computer hacker who suffers from Asperger's syndrome, and whose case has now dragged on for a decade.

Last week, the United States' ambassador to the United Kingdom, Louis Susman, told the Scotsman that, as far as he was concerned, the battle to stop McKinnon from being extradited to stand trial in the US was "over". He added: "… someone took down our whole defence system in a computer hacking incident. That made us very vulnerable." His remarks came in the wake of the review of extradition procedures carried out by the former appeal court judge, Sir Scott Baker, which gave broad approval to the status quo. Earlier this year, on a visit to London, the US attorney general, Eric Holder, said that "we will continue to take all necessary steps to have him [McKinnon] extradited to the United States and held accountable for the crimes he has committed".

Now, never mind that boring old assumption of innocence to which a defendant is normally entitled, what was clear from Holder's comments was that the pursuit of McKinnon continues. The fact that Susman is seriously suggesting that the US was made "very vulnerable" by a bloke with a computer in a north London bedroom hacking into the Nasa and US defence department computers just shows to what depths this argument has degenerated. Can a "whole defence system" really be taken down by someone looking for evidence of UFOs and leaving a few disparaging remarks about poor computer security?

In January, Ryan Cleary, the Essex teenager arrested earlier this year and accused of computer hacking, will appear at Southwark crown court in London. This follows a lengthy investigation by the British police, working in tandem with the FBI, into international hacking operations. He faces five charges under the Computer Misuse Act, the same act under which McKinnon should have been – and could still be – prosecuted.

In March this year, Ashley Mitchell appeared at Exeter crown court charged with serious computer hacking offences. He was convicted of having stolen the identities of two employees of the Zynga gaming company, which is based in San Francisco. He was accused of having broken into the Zynga mainframe and having transferred virtual gambling chips, supposedly worth £7m, to himself. It was a calculated criminal enterprise and he was jailed for two years. The point about these two cases is that they both had international ramifications but the actual alleged hacking offences had been committed in the United Kingdom so, logically, that is where they face trial.

When the current government came into power, the process to extradite McKinnon – shamefully allowed to stumble on by a Labour home secretary – was halted. Both David Cameron and Nick Clegg had been supportive of McKinnon's case in the runup to the general election, with the Lib Dem leadership even taking part in demonstrations on his behalf. Home secretary Theresa May agreed to re-examine the case and to have McKinnon's mental state assessed. Now, in the wake of the extradition laws review, it would seem that attempts are being made to bounce her into a decision.

The solution is a simple one: explain to the US authorities that McKinnon's mental condition would make it a serious breach of his human rights to extradite him for what was an embarrassment that has caused no danger or suffering to anyone – apart from McKinnon himself. It is claimed that around $700,000 worth of damage was caused but the true figure is probably a fraction of this.

The point is not that McKinnon should escape punishment for committing an offence, merely that he should be tried in the correct jurisdiction and one where his case will get a hearing free from the hysteria and paranoia that can sometimes accompany security cases in the US. If May acts now on all the medical evidence before her and halts the extradition procedures, making McKinnon accountable in the British courts – like other alleged international hackers – for what he did in north London, this whole sad tale can be brought to an end.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/oct/31/gary-mckinnon-extradition-america
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rynner2Offline
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PostPosted: 16-11-2011 08:24    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hacker Gary McKinnon 'could be tried in Britain’
Gary McKinnon, the computer hacker who has fought a 10-year battle against extradition to America, could be tried in Britain, the Attorney General has said.
By Christopher Hope, Senior Political Correspondent
6:15AM GMT 16 Nov 2011

His family feared that he would be sent to the United States after an official review found that extradition arrangements were operating fairly.
On Tuesday, however, Dominic Grieve, the Attorney General, said the review carried out by retired judge Sir Scott Baker offered “guidelines only”.

He added that the Government was considering giving British judges new powers to bar extradition. Last night Janis Sharp, Mr McKinnon’s mother, told The Daily Telegraph that she was “overjoyed” by Mr Grieve’s comments.
She added: “I am so glad to hear Dominic Grieve saying that. We would not let an animal suffer like this for 10 years.”

Isabella Sankey, the director of policy for the civil liberties campaign group Liberty, said: “It’s heartening to hear MPs speaking against unfair extradition. The majority of the last parliament — including all those now in the cabinet — voted for a forum bar and a Liberty poll last year revealed similar overwhelming support in the Commons.”

In the Commons, Mr Grieve was asked whether he would give judges discretion to allow cases such as Mr McKinnon’s to be tried in the UK.
Mr Grieve told the Commons: “That is touched on in Sir Scott Baker’s report and it is one of the matters which will have to be taken into account when the Government responds to it.
“His proposals are rather more in the nature of guidelines rather than the implementation of the forum bar itself. That is one of the matters the Government is going to have to consider.”

Sir Menzies Campbell, the former Liberal Democrat leader, said he disagreed with the report’s conclusions on the standard of proof required to initiate an extradition on either side of the Atlantic and called for reassurance from the Attorney General.
He asked that the Government ensured that “proper account be taken of the principle of reciprocity” so that Britons were not “at a constitutional disadvantage in comparison to their American counterparts”.

Mr Grieve replied: “We’re going to have to take account of what he has put forward and I hope you will make a contribution.”

Campaigners say that the 2003 Extradition Act, agreed between Britain and the US in haste after the September 11 terrorist attacks 10 years ago, is one-sided.
However, in his report last month, Sir Scott Baker ruled that it was not slanted in favour of Americans.

Mr McKinnon, 45, was accused in 2002 of using his home computer to hack into 97 American military and Nasa computers, causing damage that the US government claimed would cost more than $700,000 (£440,000) to repair.
He admits breaching the systems but denies causing damage and claims he was looking for evidence of UFOs.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/8892865/Hacker-Gary-McKinnon-could-be-tried-in-Britain.html
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JasonChapmanOffline
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PostPosted: 16-11-2011 11:34    Post subject: Reply with quote

If I was a government organisation, and I had evidence that ET exists, I wouldn't be storing any kind of information on a computer which could be hacked.
I would store my secrets on a computer but it wouldn't be connected to any network, internet etc. It would be a standalone computer, stored a mile underground, with only a limited few allowed access. The computer wouldn't have any USB ports CD rewriter or anything that would allow people to grab information off it.
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