| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
ramonmercado Psycho Punk
Joined: 19 Aug 2003 Total posts: 17210 Location: Dublin Gender: Male |
 Posted: 03-04-2012 13:14 Post subject: |
 |
|
|
| Quote: | RUC suspicions that evidence destroyed by gardaí on possible 'firing point' disputed
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2012/0331/1224314163477.html
TIM O’BRIEN
Sat, Mar 31, 2012
RUC suspicions that vital forensic evidence indicating a possible “firing point” for the Narrow Water bombing was destroyed by members of the Garda was disputed at the Smithwick Tribunal yesterday.
Two bombs were detonated at Narrow Water near Warrenpoint in Northern Ireland in August 1979.
They resulted in the largest single loss of life to the British army in the Troubles.
Eighteen soldiers and one tourist were killed and it was believed the bomb was detonated from across Carlingford Lough in the Republic. Former Garda forensic expert Det Sgt Patrick Ennis, who spent 30 years in the ballistics section, said gardaí had followed proper procedures during their search for evidence and had even visited each others’ forensic laboratories.
Mr Ennis said he searched the suspected sites where the IRA members were supposed to have hidden and had personally removed the forensic evidence for analysis.
The tribunal resumes on April 17th. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
| rynner2 What a Cad!
Great Old One Joined: 13 Dec 2008 Total posts: 19194 Location: Under the moon Gender: Male |
| Posted: 10-04-2012 07:22 Post subject: |
|
|
|
Dissident republicans arrested in Londonderry
Six men have been arrested following a dissident republican commemoration in Londonderry.
Several hundred people attended a rally at a cemetery. Police said they kept a distance from the event, but a security force helicopter monitored the scene.
The arrested men were taken to Antrim police station for questioning.
Easter Monday saw republicans honour the Easter Rising of 1916, when rebels seized control of parts of Dublin and proclaimed Ireland a republic.
The BBC's Ireland correspondent Mark Simpson said a masked man read out a statement from the Real IRA during the event and a small group of men lined up and marched in paramilitary style uniforms.
In the statement, the Real IRA - the group which killed two soldiers in Antrim three years ago - threatened to keep targeting police officers.
Our correspondent added that police intervened after the rally was over and carried out a number of searches.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-foyle-west-17658661
Will this festering sore never heal?  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| Spookdaddy Cuckoo Joined: 24 May 2006 Total posts: 3760 Location: Midwich Gender: Unknown |
| Posted: 10-04-2012 08:07 Post subject: |
|
|
|
I don't think it's necessarily a symptom of wild-eyed nuttery to commemorate the Easter Rising - as a seminal event in the birth of a modern nation it's really no different to Bastille Day or the Fourth of July celebrations (or the very many other commemorations of independence that take place worldwide.)
Maybe the event has been entirely taken over by dissident republicanism - ramon can probably keep us up to the mark on that - but I suspect, as with many other similar celebrations of national identity, that the festering sores are in the hearts of some of those attending rather than the event itself. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| rynner2 What a Cad!
Great Old One Joined: 13 Dec 2008 Total posts: 19194 Location: Under the moon Gender: Male |
| Posted: 10-04-2012 08:43 Post subject: |
|
|
|
| Spookdaddy wrote: | I don't think it's necessarily a symptom of wild-eyed nuttery to commemorate the Easter Rising - as a seminal event in the birth of a modern nation it's really no different to Bastille Day or the Fourth of July celebrations...
..I suspect, as with many other similar celebrations of national identity, that the festering sores are in the hearts of some of those attending rather than the event itself. |
That's what I meant.
Paramilitary uniforms and threats of 'targetting' police officers should be no part of any 'celebration'. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| ramonmercado Psycho Punk
Joined: 19 Aug 2003 Total posts: 17210 Location: Dublin Gender: Male |
| Posted: 10-04-2012 14:59 Post subject: |
|
|
|
| rynner2 wrote: | | Spookdaddy wrote: | I don't think it's necessarily a symptom of wild-eyed nuttery to commemorate the Easter Rising - as a seminal event in the birth of a modern nation it's really no different to Bastille Day or the Fourth of July celebrations...
..I suspect, as with many other similar celebrations of national identity, that the festering sores are in the hearts of some of those attending rather than the event itself. |
That's what I meant.
Paramilitary uniforms and threats of 'targetting' police officers should be no part of any 'celebration'. |
Well military uniforms tend to be a part of many celebrations,albeit legal ones.
SF would still organise Easter 1916 cimmemorations but it would no longer supply a paramilitary element.
I dont think it was the colour party that bothered the PSNI so much as the masked RIRA man reading out a declaration of war.
Yes the festering sores are in the hearts of the leaders of the RIRA, but there hasn't been a peace dividend for everyone. The RIRA get many of their recruits from sink estates.
A security based solution led by MI5 is not going to defeat the dissidents. I'll come back later with more on this. In a cybercafe in Cork with crappy pc, its a wonder they don't still use Babbage engines. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| balding13 Great Old One Joined: 22 Sep 2006 Total posts: 188 Gender: Male |
| Posted: 11-04-2012 12:24 Post subject: |
|
|
|
A security based solution led by MI5 is not going to defeat the dissidents
This will almost read like an homage to Stewart Lee http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jxYzQtSxoKE
but in reality the current iteration of 'dissident' republicans have no policies, tactics or strategies beyond the purity of continuing the 'struggle'. Currently the Republic has the highest murder rate in Western Europe (mainly Dublin and Limerick) and outside the specific dissident/dealer wars, former pira bombmakers seem to be selling pipe bombs to travellers for feuds once fought with shotguns and bill hooks.
It isn't politics, just business as usual. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| ramonmercado Psycho Punk
Joined: 19 Aug 2003 Total posts: 17210 Location: Dublin Gender: Male |
| Posted: 11-04-2012 13:32 Post subject: |
|
|
|
Its a sad situation alright but idealistic young people are being sucked into a hopeless struggle. If it was just gangsters then a security solution would work. The dissidents don't have the fish to swim among like the provos had. They lack the vast network of safe houses.
They also lack the arms dumps of the provos. As the various splits away from PIRA took place, only very small amounts of armanents were lost. Hence in the final PIRA disarming enough weaponary to arm a regular BA battalion was handed over along with mortars, heavy machine guns and tons of semtex.
Which is why you find fools being entrapped by MI5 & MI6 as they attempt to source arms abroad.
I know some of the younger people in the political wings of the dissidents. They get involved in progressive causes. No point in me just telling them they are idiots who are being misled but hopefully more subtle arguments will work. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| ramonmercado Psycho Punk
Joined: 19 Aug 2003 Total posts: 17210 Location: Dublin Gender: Male |
| Posted: 11-04-2012 13:54 Post subject: |
|
|
|
Well stone the crows!
Maybe this should go in forgotten history but theres something so Irish about it, I'll put it here.
| Quote: | Nuns asked for sniper to kill crows
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2012/0411/1224314609470.html
MICHAEL PARSONS
Wed, Apr 11, 2012
TIPPERARY NUNS asked the British army to send a sniper to shoot jackdaws and crows which were “ruining” potatoes in the convent garden during the War of Independence.
The quintessential Irish solution to an Irish problem is revealed in a letter – sent more than 90 years ago during the final years of British rule in Ireland – which has turned up in an auction saleroom.
The Presentation Order of nuns in Fethard, Co Tipperary, had a convent garden to grow their own food. However the nuns were pestered by birds swooping on the crops and the reverend mother called on the might of the world’s most powerful imperial army to defeat the feathered attackers.
Sr Imelda was delegated to write to the “Officer in Command” at the local military barracks, home to soldiers of the Royal Field Artillery. She asked if he “could kindly send down one of your men to shoot some jackdaws and crows which are ruining our potatoes, peas and other vegetables in our garden”.
The nuns were forced to ask the British military to do the dirty deed because the Irish were not, officially, allowed to carry guns. The War of Independence was under way and Co Tipperary was a hotbed of rebels. Explaining the nuns’ predicament, Sr Imelda wrote: “We have asked several farmers around to shoot them [the birds] but all say they can’t use a gun even to protect their crops.”
The despondent nuns were also “very much inconvenienced” by the birds eating chickenfeed left out for their fowl. Sr Imelda concluded by asking the officer to let her know if he “could do anything in this matter”.
Sadly, it is not known if the officer responded to the request. Fethard military barracks was evacuated by the British after the Anglo-Irish Treaty was signed in December 1921, and subsequently taken over by Republican rebels and burnt down.
The nuns’ letter is to be auctioned by Mealy’s, a rare book and manuscript auctioneers, in Dublin on April 25th, and has a modest presale estimate of between €60 and €80. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| balding13 Great Old One Joined: 22 Sep 2006 Total posts: 188 Gender: Male |
| Posted: 11-04-2012 14:08 Post subject: |
|
|
|
I know some of the younger people in the political wings of the dissidents
Me too. One young feller wanted to join the RIRA or CIRA to 'sort out' the local dealers. Sadly I've heard enough people mourn the current failure to end anti-social behaviour like in the 'good old days'. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| ramonmercado Psycho Punk
Joined: 19 Aug 2003 Total posts: 17210 Location: Dublin Gender: Male |
| Posted: 11-04-2012 14:23 Post subject: |
|
|
|
Ghouls. I feel like disrupting the auction, getting the hair and burying it in his grave.
| Quote: | Hair from corpse of Michael Collins to be auctioned in Dublin
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2012/0409/1224314547356.html
MICHAEL PARSONS
Mon, Apr 09, 2012
IS NOTHING sacred? Macabre mementos of the death of Michael Collins have come to light: a lock of hair taken from the dead leader’s head and a cotton swab used to clean his corpse are among the items being offered for sale at specialist auctions of Irish historical memorabilia later this month.
Auctioneers Adam’s of St Stephen’s Green, Dublin, is to sell “an envelope containing a lock of tangled brown hair” which is inscribed “Hair of head of Michael Collins when laid in State in the City Hall August 1922”.
The souvenir was owned by Kitty Collins Sheridan (Collins’s elder sister) who gave it to a friend in the late 1950s. The vendor’s name has not been disclosed. Adam’s expects the item will sell for up to €5,000 at its auction titled “800 Years – Irish Political, Military and Literary History” on April 18th .
Collins was shot dead at Béal na mBláth in west Cork during the Civil War 90 years ago on the evening of August 22nd, 1922. The fatal bullet had struck his head. Comrades brought his body to Dublin by sea on board the steamship Classic.
Collins’s body was taken to St Vincent’s Hospital to be embalmed by a team of pathologists before being removed to lie in state at Dublin City Hall.
Auctioneers Mealy’s said that a framed swab of lint and cotton wool used to clean Collins’s face was kept by a nurse, Nessie Rogan, who worked at St Vincent’s Hospital. It has been passed down though her family.
It is to be sold in an auction titled “Ireland’s Struggle – Irish and Republican Memorabilia” in Dublin on April 25th and has a pre-sale estimate of €450-€600.
The growing cult of Michael Collins is evidenced by the sheer volume of memorabilia coming on to the market just months ahead of the 90th anniversary of his death.
Among other items in the Adam’s auction is a photograph showing Collins standing on an ironwork balcony, said to be at No. 10 Downing Street, where he negotiated the Anglo-Irish Treaty in 1921, and a letter from a priest to Collins’s sister Celestine (a nun), describing him as “one of Ireland’s hidden saints” .
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| rynner2 What a Cad!
Great Old One Joined: 13 Dec 2008 Total posts: 19194 Location: Under the moon Gender: Male |
| Posted: 11-04-2012 15:29 Post subject: |
|
|
|
| Quote: | | The Presentation Order of nuns in Fethard, Co Tipperary... |
Please tell me that Fethard rhymes with 'feathered'! 
Last edited by rynner2 on 11-04-2012 19:43; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| ramonmercado Psycho Punk
Joined: 19 Aug 2003 Total posts: 17210 Location: Dublin Gender: Male |
| Posted: 11-04-2012 17:44 Post subject: |
|
|
|
| rynner2 wrote: | | Quote: | | The Presentation Order of nuns in Fethard, Co Tipperary... |
Please tell me that Fethard rymes with 'feathered'! |
Sadly its fetard. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| amyasleigh Great Old One Joined: 03 Nov 2009 Total posts: 346 Gender: Unknown |
| Posted: 11-04-2012 18:23 Post subject: |
|
|
|
Maybe getting onto rather frivolous by-paths here; but as a Brit whose interest in things Irish has always turned out to be mostly "armchair" and not at first-hand; I find Irish place-names tricky, and very frequently not pronounced, as you'd imagine from reading them.
One instance: the town just on the County Monaghan side of the border, called Clones. For decades, having only seen it in print, I pronounced it in my head, as per "multiple Dolly-the-Sheeps". Was surprised to actually hear the pronunciation: "Cloa-ness", with approximately equal stress on each syllable. You live and learn. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| skinny Roaring Fortean
Great Old One Joined: 30 May 2010 Total posts: 115 Location: Adelaide Age: 42 Gender: Male |
| Posted: 12-04-2012 02:13 Post subject: |
|
|
|
I am very keenly researching all things Irish as a kind of mid-life crisis of identity related to my own Irish heritage (5th generation Australian). I have read histories and biographies, and personal family history is emerging from the mists of time by the month. I've found myself very much sympathetic to SF, and Adams in particular, but I'm not entirely convinced that he was head of the PIRA as most biographies seem to imply. I think it's entirely plausible that he has always been politically active without ever resorting to more than negotiating with the armed wings. Accusations of direct complicity with bombings and decisions to murder and torture are entirely out of character with what I've seen and heard from the man.
ramonmercado, you seem to have affiliations, but I'm a little in the dark as regards your connections to it all apart from your geographical proximity. Seems a bit oafish to blurt it out like this, but do you know if Gerry is / was once part of ranking RA leadership? It still won't diminish my admiration of his and his people's struggle if he were, but I'd like to hear what you and others think.
Sorry I haven't had time to get through all of the preceding 40 pages of the thread yet. If this has been addressed or is off-topic, perhaps someone could bing me a discreet PM about it with a link.
Cheers. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| ramonmercado Psycho Punk
Joined: 19 Aug 2003 Total posts: 17210 Location: Dublin Gender: Male |
| Posted: 12-04-2012 14:52 Post subject: |
|
|
|
Despite his denials Gerry Adams held important positions in the IRA from the beginning of the Troubles. During the most important stages of negotisations with the British Govt, Adams was not just on the Army Council, he was head of Northern Command. Gerry Kelly was Adjutant General (in charge of discipline). Martin McGuinness was Chair of the Army Council and was the lead negoiatern the discussiond with the British Government.
Adams and McGuinness did lead SF & the IRA down a certain road. Because of that some have suggested that McGuinness if not Adams as well were British agents. A conspiracy too far imho. SF & the IRA wre penetrated at high levels but not that high.
Were Adams & McGuinness ever Marxists? Maybe not, but they wouldn't be the first to drift from Marxism on the road to power.
Sorry? Did someone mention Jack Straw and Mandy?
Good books on the IRA and SF would include:
Armed Struggle: The History of the IRA by Richard English
A Secret History of the IRA by Ed Moloney
Voices from the Grave by Ed Moloney |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
