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Anonymous
PostPosted: 01-11-2003 10:21    Post subject: lost lands Reply with quote

having started a thread on atlantis i was surprized by the number of "lost lands" out there:eek!!!!

could you please post any links about them.thanks.
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BreakfastologistOffline
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PostPosted: 01-11-2003 22:23    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some lost lands may fall into the subset of flooded kingdoms which has proved a popular topic here...
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Anonymous
PostPosted: 19-11-2003 22:06    Post subject: Re: lost lands Reply with quote

markc101 wrote:

having started a thread on atlantis i was surprized by the number of "lost lands" out there:eek!!!!
could you please post any links about them.thanks.




Mark,
My spirit tells me...not as a psychic,or anything as such, that
there is a large piece of history about our world,that is missing.
We all, as human beings must sense this.
The ancients,and archealogy of our time speak to us in logical terms.
I ask you this: Without further research,which would be nice, and confirming...of the following belief...but is not...How much will be left of our current civilation in 10,000 yrs.? Will music tapes survive?? CD's?? Computer's, Auto's,Jet planes,film data,clothing,written language and deciphering i.e.understanding of what has been (within our time)written??
All these things I've mentioned are perishable, and certainly products that will not survive 10,000 yrs. Stone will however.
Stone writtings in future tense (if mankind survives at all) will provide only a piece of the repetition. The ancient Sumerians bring many questions. Giants???
It is so hard for me to believe, that the American Continent was not discovered, until ???????????????? 1492???????????or perhaps a bit earlier, when consideration is given ( in accordance to Earth's Lifespan) and/or as being within the first millennium..The first thousand yrs. people were terrified at the turn of the century,and the same can be said by Y2K (this one). I have often heard of Captain Cooke and his ventures. How he should be compared to a modern day Moon walking Astronaut. This seems quite true,when one thinks of a vast dark sea of the unknown.
The Earth is supposedly flat,and questions of: Is there an end to the sea, and if so, where? This borders on courage and insanity. Actually,a trip to the Moon would be less in question,since a great deal of knowledge,understanding, and destiny of the project was known before lift off.
From all this, I cannot help but know, that logically mankind has lived before...reaching the peaks of Technology
as other Planets have in the past. Universally,we have not found life on other planets,because we as humankind have come about at a time that missed those civilations (that have and had existed before we understood the differences).While we maybe hadn't existed, they did, and then when we evolved they had already been past extinction many many millions of yrs.,if not billions???? It does make one question. The depth is beyond the human mind,but the human mind can grasp the ideology of it all on a basic level. Wheewww!
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Anonymous
PostPosted: 19-11-2003 22:11    Post subject: some stories of lost lands Reply with quote

To all:

In fact, the list of "lost" or "fabled" lands covers quite a wide area. There seems almost no area of the earth that has not seen stories of strange, and, later, unrecovered lands present there, although, because of their possibility for isolation, "lost lands" often exist in the ocean, or across the ocean from where the stories about them are circulated.

Atlantis, often to be found mentioned on the Fortean Times site, is only one of the lands that were recorded, through time, as lost, and, intriguingly, it, like so many of the others, may be on the verge of being discovered as true, or based on truth. There are stories, now, that lands once above the oceans, during the latest ice age, and later covered by water when the ice melt, may be the basis for the Atlantis story. A region just west of Gibraltar, it was even recently mentioned on the Fortean Times website, may be the inspiration for Atlantis.

Another commonly referred to story is that of Lyonesse, sometimes referred to as a land, sometimes as a city, that sunk beneath the seas.

But other lands were also mentioned, over time. There is, for example, Fu-Sang, the kingdom discovered by the Buddhist monk Hoei-Shin or Hwui-Shen; there is the land described by the individual claiming the name Prester John; there's Lemuria; there's Mu. And there are other sunken cities, such as Ys, and Cantref Gwaelod. For the most part, what are referred to as “lost lands” seem to constitute either places that sank, or that were never located.

Fu-Sang, for example, derives from the story told by the Buddhistic monk Hoei-Shin or Hwui-Shen, in the imperial court of Middle Kingdom China in 499 A.D. Three years earlier - interestingly enough, just one year after Germanic soldiers marched into Rome, signaling the official Fall of The Roman Empire in the West, and the beginning of Europe’s Dark Ages - Hwui-Shen and four other individuals, journeyed to a land 20,000 li, or about 7,000 miles, east of the Middle Kingdom. There they encountered a land of individuals who lived in wood structures, with woven mats on the floor; who had separate jails in the north and south, for serious and petty crimes, respectively; who communicated with a written language; and who depended on a plant they called the “fu-sang”, that “grew like bamboo”, had fruit “like a pear, but red”, and which the natives used for everything from food to “cordage”. He also spoke of a “sea of varnish”; presumably, “smoking mountains”; and a “Kingdom of Women”, a “Great Han Country”, and a “Land of Marked (or Tattooed) Bodies”. Based on the descriptions, many have assumed Fu-Sang was, actually, the West Coast of the United States! Some descriptions resemble depictions of Indians of the Northwest, while others seem to represent the peoples of pre-Columbian Middle America. The “fu-sang” has been interpreted to be everything from the maguey to the pipe organ cactus to even early corn! The “sea of varnish” is suspected to be the La Brea Tarpits, and the “smoking mountains” could be any of the volcanic peaks along the Rockies. There was significant tendency to disbelieve that Fu-Sang could be the Western United States, but, in the late Seventies and Eighties, apparently, there were reports of Chinese anchors of just the right age found in waters off the coast of California!

Also rooted in a story, The Kingdom of Prester John, however, has never been satisfactorily located on the map. The tale of the Kingdom of Prester John begins in the early 12th century, with a letter to the then Pope in Rome, from the ruler of a land “in the East”, rich with gold and filled with “many strange animals”, possibly also accompanied by the presumed visit of this potentate to the Pope. The leader was, presumably, a devoted Christian. There are those who say this was intended to combat the influence of the Muslim populations in Europe. Investigations, however, seem not to have been successful in locating such a land to the east of Europe. Others say that the “East” referred to meant Africa, and suggest that the kingdom really was Ethiopia. One can suggest that the literal worship of former Ethiopian emperor Haile Salassi - the root of Rastafar - is based in the historical significance placed in Ethiopia because of this, or the feeling of significance that led to this.

Lands can become “lost”, too, by literally supposedly sinking out of sight. Atlantis is but the best known version, but there are numerous other examples. Among the best known continents that supposedly disappeared are Mu and Lemuria.

Much of what is attributed to Mu is based on the writings of James Churchward, in the early part of the 20th century. As Atlantis was founded on writings by Plato, the story of Mu came from inscriptions by cultures ranging from the Maya to Indians to even Egyptians. There is no one coherent depiction Churchward relies on, but, rather, cullings and what one might call interpretations from disparate works. Mu, presumably, sat in the middle of the Pacific Ocean, and sank when “gas chambers” beneath the continent erupted and collapsed.

Unlike Atlantis and Mu, whose existence was based on putative reports of their existence, Lemuria’s existence was entirely hypothesized by what it was supposed to do. Biologists in the 19th century were surprised to find similar species of lemurs in two widely separated areas, on Madagascar, off the eastern coast of Africa, and in Indonesia, far to the east of Africa. Their solution was to posit the former existence of a continent that stretched from Africa to the Malay Peninsula. The name, in fact, comes only from the fact that it was supposed to have been a land bridge for lemurs! Because there is no real evidence for Lemuria beyond what it was supposed to do, there are those who have suggested that Lemuria actually stretched from Australia to Malaysia, or, even, that it ran from Africa to the Americas! The loss of Lemuria was never directly addressed, except, apparently, to just say that it, too, must have sunk into the sea.

The places Ys, Lyonesse and Cantref Gwaelod constitute much smaller areas to be lost to the sea, Ys and Cantref Gwaelod being cities, Lyonesse being a country, but, presumably, on the order of the size of Cornwall or Wales.

Lyonesse is said to have stretched far westward from Land’s End, in Cornwall. It had “many fine cities and 140 churches”. On November 11, 1099 A.D., the sea overran the land. Only one man, named Trevilian, escaped, on a white horse. It has been said, by, among others, Stanley Ralph, a reporter for The News Chronicle, in the 1930’s, that the ringing of bells from the sunken land could be heard.

The story of Ys begins with King Gradlon of Cornwall. Declaring war on an enemy potentate of the north., he stormed his city. His men grew tired of the siege, however, and left. It was then that Gradlon was approached by the king’s wife, Malgven, Queen of the North. She agreed to help Gradlon defeat her husband. After slaying the old king, Gradlon and Malgven departed for Cornwall, on Morvarc’h, which means “the horse of the sea”. Catching up with the departing fleet, they caused a great storm that scattered the ships. Gradlon and Malgven remained at sea for a year and a day, and during that time, Malgven gave birth to Gradlon’s daughter, Dahut. Shortly afterward, Malgven died, and Gradlon traveled to Brittany, with his daughter. There, Dahut told her father that she loved the sea. To satisfy her, Gradlon had a huge city built offshore, standing on the sea floor! To keep it from being inundated, he had a huge wall built around it, with a single great door, opening onto the sea. He kept the key to the door around his neck. Living in the city, among other things, Dahut would have a different betrothed each night, wearing a black mask. When day broke, the mask would tighten and kill each man. One day, a stranger, dressed in red - whom some identify with the Devil - entered the city and agreed to be Dahut’s betrothed for the night. During the night, he convinced her to steal the key from her father, and open the door onto the sea. She entered her father’s room, to steal the key, but, suddenly, a huge wave covered the city. Trying to escape, Dahut mounted Morvarc’h, but, it is said, Saint Guenole appeared and cursed her. Morvarc’h wouldn’t move. When Dahut died, Gradlon mounted Morvarc’h, and, now, the horse could run. It ran to the city of Qumiper, and, there, he stopped. A statue of King Gradlon, sitting on Mrovarc’h, and looking towards Ys is said still to stand there. In tribute to the magnificence of the destroyed city, is it also recounted, the city of Lutece was renamed Par Ys, meaning “on a par with Ys”, and, from that, we get Paris! Some say you can still hear the bells of Ys ringing beneath the waves, at times.

As with, apparently, many areas around the British Isles, some thousands of years ago, when water is said to have been locked up in Ice Age snows, land now covered by shallow depths of water was above ground. The area now called Cardigan Bay, it seems, once hosted forests of trees. One story calls the land that was once above water Maes Gwyddno, or “The Land of Gwyddno”. It is said that it was inundated when a priestess of a fairy well allowed it to overflow. Another story calls the area Cantref Gwaelod, or “The Lowland Hundred”, and says it encompassed 16 cities. The king, Gwyddno Garanhir, and a drunkard, Saeithennin, left the sluice gates open, and the land was flooded. It is said, now, that, at times, too, the bells from the sunken cities can be heard! They are termed the “Aberdovey Bells”.

It is interesting to note that many of the stories of flooded coastal cities tell of underwater bells that can be heard. There are, supposedly, areas around the world where sands, based on their consistency and shape, and surrounding conditions, can “ring”, “boom” and even “bark”. It is possible that something similar, coupled with hollowed out rock underfoot, and the effect of waves, can be said to produce the sounds attributed to bells from the flooded lands.

There seem to be other available stories, but these are a beginning.




Julian Penrod
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Timble2Offline
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PostPosted: 20-11-2003 10:31    Post subject: Reply with quote

Netslave you make a lot of assumption’s: the existence of America was known or at least strongly suspected by European long before Columbus, the Viking almost certainly visited, there’s evidence that others made the journey, and that mariners were aware of the existence of the lands…if you believed all the accounts Columbus was probably the last person to discover America.

And by the time we get to Cooke what he was doing wasn’t really a step into the unknown, more a step into the unmapped, unexplored and undocumented – they had a fair idea of what they’d find out there. The Endeavour was a purpose-built scientific exploration ship.

There’s stuff that will survive 10,000 years glass, ceramics, so parts of electrical power networks will survive, the foundations of our cities, perhaps more if they’re buried, landfill sites pits will be a an adventure playground for future archaeologists, quite what state, the remains of nuclear power station will be fairly evident. Metal artefact could survive in the right conditions, they may find the remains of tanks with the semi-fossiled remains of their crews in the sands of a country with the long-forgotten name of Iraq. There’s mines and quarries which could survive. A technological civilization would leave a deep mark on the planet.

Glaciation could scrape quite a lot of evidence from the face of the earth, but the whole planet wasn’t covered by the ice age, if there had been a civilization like ours before, there’d be a lot more than stone.

There probably are lost cultures, IMO but they weren’t technological in any way that was similar to ours.
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PostPosted: 20-11-2003 10:44    Post subject: Reply with quote

Timble wrote:

There probably are lost cultures, IMO but they weren’t technological in any way that was similar to ours.
And there's the point, we tend to project our own visions and dreams, our own ideas about Civilization and culture onto the unknown.

So that, perhaps when evidence does turn up, we're always disappointed, because we expected, something bigger, better, more advanced. So once again, we move the goalposts further and deeper into the unknown. Into Antarctica, under the oceans, into space, beyond the stars.

Dreamers.
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PostPosted: 20-11-2003 14:04    Post subject: Reply with quote

One of the marks of our civilisation is it's placing of value on size- more and bigger is always better- there have never been as many people as there are now, nothing close. There are enough places in the world that have been lost or mislaid or fallen down the cosmic sofa that a previous "advanced" civilisation could have existed and just been completely lost. One of the questions about that must be about what we mean by an "advanced" civilisation. What are we looking for? Would it be good enough if they were as advanced as the Romans, or using bronze 15000 years ago? Are we just looking to demean the achievements of more recent civilisations or our own?

I think perhaps if we don't know what we are looking for we will never know if we have found it.
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PostPosted: 20-11-2003 18:43    Post subject: Reply with quote

Breakfast wrote:

One of the marks of our civilisation is it's placing of value on size- more and bigger is always better- there have never been as many people as there are now, nothing close. There are enough places in the world that have been lost or mislaid or fallen down the cosmic sofa that a previous "advanced" civilisation could have existed and just been completely lost. One of the questions about that must be about what we mean by an "advanced" civilisation. What are we looking for? Would it be good enough if they were as advanced as the Romans, or using bronze 15000 years ago? Are we just looking to demean the achievements of more recent civilisations or our own?
I think perhaps if we don't know what we are looking for we will never know if we have found it.




Excellent point that ,"if we do not know what we are looking for we will never know if we have found it". Another thought: after this generation of humankind is gone, how will future generations of people know what to look for about us??? Pieces of our world as we know it,may surface from time to time...bringing to the futures
only questions,just as we in this generation. Some technology today is not made up of matter i.e. cyber space,radio waves, etc.
The futures (meaning peoples) could have technologies as advanced,yet different from our time. Harnassing technologies we know nothing about (the same said,for futures) cannot be found,because we don't know what if it; we are looking for.
However I would like to add, that enough evidence exists about our world's past civilations to suggest Continental connections as in architechture similarities,consumption of the same plant foods and drugs found only in the current separated parts of land (Continents),similar knowledge and mythologies etc.,when navigation was not supposed to be, at least not in the same realm as we know it, yet it would have had to have been in order for them to have the similar connections found. It is not just airy or dreamy beliefs that fuel my beliefs about the world's past...
It is also based on the factual. The rest is as the Elephant,it is in the DNA.
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Anonymous
PostPosted: 20-11-2003 19:19    Post subject: Reply with quote

Timble wrote:

Netslave you make a lot of assumption’s: the existence of America was known or at least strongly suspected by European long before Columbus, the Viking almost certainly visited, there’s evidence that others made the journey, and that mariners were aware of the existence of the lands…if you believed all the accounts Columbus was probably the last person to discover America.

And by the time we get to Cooke what he was doing wasn’t really a step into the unknown, more a step into the unmapped, unexplored and undocumented – they had a fair idea of what they’d find out there. The Endeavour was a purpose-built scientific exploration ship.

There’s stuff that will survive 10,000 years glass, ceramics, so parts of electrical power networks will survive, the foundations of our cities, perhaps more if they’re buried, landfill sites pits will be a an adventure playground for future archaeologists, quite what state, the remains of nuclear power station will be fairly evident. Metal artefact could survive in the right conditions, they may find the remains of tanks with the semi-fossiled remains of their crews in the sands of a country with the long-forgotten name of Iraq. There’s mines and quarries which could survive. A technological civilization would leave a deep mark on the planet.

Glaciation could scrape quite a lot of evidence from the face of the earth, but the whole planet wasn’t covered by the ice age, if there had been a civilization like ours before, there’d be a lot more than stone.

There probably are lost cultures, IMO but they weren’t technological in any way that was similar to ours.




Timble, I do not mean to appear assuming,or presumptuous...I am merely speculating,theorizing,and offering a different philosophy to the equation.
Since no one is certain about our world's past, it does not hurt to present differing views on the topic.
I'd like to present another thought to toss around... Our world is 3/4 water...practically a water world...land mass is all we have,except for a few sub dives,and recovery to substantiate what we currently know. I have heard about the Vikings "Red" coming to America,and I believe that. I also believe the Chinese came to America. Landfall for Europeans in the New World probably did occur upon Colubus' arrival in the West Indies.
In my opinion, Capt.Cooke was mighty brave. He knew that there was land out there on the vast abyss...but no astronaut went into space with the thought in mind..." There are planets out there,and I'm not sure where,but I'm headed in that direction anyway".
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Anonymous
PostPosted: 20-11-2003 21:33    Post subject: Reply with quote

netslave wrote:

Timble, I do not mean to appear assuming,or presumptuous...I am merely speculating,theorizing,and offering a different philosophy to the equation.
Since no one is certain about our world's past, it does not hurt to present differing views on the topic.
I'd like to present another thought to toss around... Our world is 3/4 water...practically a water world...land mass is all we have,except for a few sub dives,and recovery to substantiate what we currently know. I have heard about the Vikings "Red" coming to America,and I believe that. I also believe the Chinese came to America. Landfall for Europeans in the New World probably did occur upon Colubus' arrival in the West Indies.
In my opinion, Capt.Cooke was mighty brave. He knew that there was land out there on the vast abyss...but no astronaut went into space with the thought in mind..." There are planets out there,and I'm not sure where,but I'm headed in that direction anyway".



I also thought this: Maybe some things maybe (might even) will survive 10,000 yrs.,then double the 10,000 figure... given enough time nothing would survive but stone,yet stone also erodes in time. Glass wears thin with the elements, until it disappears ,or melts,metals wear thin and finally deteriorate and /or corrodes ,plastics turn to dust in time, Quarries of rock or stone can be found today from our ancient past but what does that mean to us?? Will future civilizations know what a Nuke is??? Or to look for it????

As far as,Iraq is concerned that hurts. Iraq is a 7,000 yr.old, if not older civilization in the midst of the biblical Mesopatamia. The supposed "Garden of Eden" is said by many archealogists to rest between the Euphrates and Tigris Rivers. This an ancient land with no concept of Democracy.Who is to say they might like it ,or
need it? They are so culturally different from the west: I ask,how could they understand it. They have different needs, according to their culture.
When the Commander-in-Thief pulled up the for sell sign on the White House lawn I had to question where America is headed. When the fool first said,IRAQ! I could not help but wonder why Iraq???
America is allowing,or financially and politically helpless to change the antics of the current Administration. Our military is (so unfortuneately) dying and being used as proxy for the rich oil barrons and war lords cashing in on their contractual agreements such as Halliburton,Betchal,etc. Heavy funders to the Bush regime. Damn it!!!,,,,,, it all looks so bad and hurts so much. Is this what my forefathers meant? Is this what my relatives paid for with flesh and blood fought for???? I think not. Hitler even said, "The best one can want is to keep it's citizens ignorant". Yes, we have fallen for a Demagogue!!! A Demogogue,I say...the type our ancestors warned us about. Our fellow countrymen are under the spell of Arrogance accompanied with ignorance. Arrogance and Ignorance are running hand in hand!
I hope our British counterparts give Bush HELL!!! I am laughing all the way. Bring down the Bush statue! For America's sake. Thanks. Many, if not most (who aren't paid off) or (scared by the Patriot Act) are behind the U.K. Yeah!!! Keep up the good work! Maybe many here will follow suit... I know, they (American's) had better,if they love their country here at all.
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PostPosted: 21-11-2003 08:12    Post subject: Reply with quote

netslave wrote:



Timble, I do not mean to appear assuming,or presumptuous...I am merely speculating,theorizing,and offering a different philosophy to the equation.



Hey, you're not being presumptious, the whole I idea of the board is to discuss ideas, you throw in some stuff, I throw in some stuff other people throw in some stuff and we kick it around.
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PostPosted: 26-07-2004 19:13    Post subject: Re: lost lands Reply with quote

markc101 wrote:

having started a thread on atlantis i was surprized by the number of "lost lands" out there:eek!!!!

could you please post any links about them.thanks.


Huy Brasil or Hy Brazil

IIRC some tales refer it as being inhabited by fairies.

Kipling mentioned it in Puck of Pook's Hill and


Quote:

Brazil, also known as Hy-Brazil or several other variants, is a phantom island which features in many Irish Celtic myths. It was said to be cloaked in mist, except for one day each seven years, when it became visible but could still not be reached. It probably has similar roots to St Brendan's Island.

Despite the myths surrounding it, belief in the island was so strong that several expeditions left to search for it in the late fifteenth century, the last led by John Cabot. Some claimed to have seen the island, or even landed on it, the last supposed sighting being in 1872.



from the Wikipedia- Brazil (mythical Island)
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PostPosted: 26-07-2004 19:24    Post subject: Reply with quote

St Brendan's Island is mentioned on this thread.
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PostPosted: 26-07-2004 23:23    Post subject: Reply with quote

At risk of abusing the Wikipedia (but it is one of the best sources I have found) plus I've been reading The Kalevala recently- another Fabled Land:

Pohjola which means North Country, the Arctic Region past Finland :

Quote:


Pohjola is a location in Finnish mythology, meaning North, as a point of the compass, the Northland, the whole polar region, and in the world of the Kalevala, the land of the Sami.

In the mythology, the Mistress of Pohjola is Louhi, an evil witch of great power. The Sampo is made at her behest and brought to her in payment for the hand of her daughter in marriage. (Pohjola's Daughter is the subject of a symphonic tone poem by Jean Sibelius.) The Sampo is a magic mill of plenty which churns out abundance for the people of Pohjola, but its churning lid is a symbol of the celestial vault of the heavens, embedded with stars, revolving about a central axis or pillar of the world.



and Lyonesse from the Occultopedia:

Quote:

Legendary lost land, supposedly a magical place west of Land's End in Cornwall, believed by some to be where the mortally wounded King Arthur was taken after his last battle (see Avalon). Some thought it identical with Liones, the kingdom of Tristan's father, but this may originally have been Lothian (Leoneis), later confused with a region of Brittany (Leonais).

Other legends tell that, when Arthur had fallen in his last battle, Mordred pursued the remnant of his army into Lyonesse. The ghost of Merlin appeared, the land sank and Mordred's forces were destroyed. Arthur's men, however, reached what are now the Isles of Scilly and survived.

Did such a land exist? Reference is made to it in Camden's Survey of Cornwall (1602). In Roman times the Scillies seem to have been a single island partially overrun by the sea. It is said that local fishermen have pulled up stones from the buildings of Lyonesse in their nets, and that to this day the bells of long submerged churches can be heard on still nights. In the 1930s Stanley Baron, a journalist working for the London News Chronicle, claimed to have heard bells when staying at Sennen Cove, immediately to the north of Land's End. Edith Olivier, a sometime mayor of Wilton, near Salisbury, allegedly saw some of the domes and spires of Lyonesse in the sea, when standing on the cliffs at Land's End.

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PostPosted: 26-07-2004 23:49    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've never seen the wikipedia before. But I agree that it is good, as I have just looked up Avalon

Quote:
valon is a legendary island somewhere in the British Isles.

It is sometimes referred to as the legendary location where Jesus visited the British Isles with Joseph of Arimathea and that it was later the site of the first church in Britain. This location of the Isle of Avalon is usually associated with present day Glastonbury.

It is also said to be the place where the body of King Arthur is buried. He was supposedly brought there via boat by his half sister, Morgan le Fay. According to some legends Arthur merely sleeps there, to awaken at some future time.

According to one theory the word is an anglicisation of the Celtic "Annwyn", the realm of fairies, or netherworld. Geoffrey of Monmouth interpreted the name as the "isle of apples". It would tend to be highly probable, given the fact that apple is still Aval in Breton and Cornish and Afal in Welsh, which pronounces the single f more as a v, and such an extreme corruption is itself highly doubtful.

As early at least as the beginning of the 11th century the tradition that Arthur was buried at Glastonbury Tor appears to have taken shape. Before the surrounding fenland in the Somerset Levels was drained, Glastonbury's high round bulk rose out of the water-meadows like an island. In the reign of Henry II, according to the chronicler Giraldus of Cambrai and others, the abbot Henry de Blois commissioned a search, apparently discovering at the depth of 16 feet a massive oak trunk with an inscription Hic jacet sepultus inclitus rex Arthurus in insula Avalonia. The remains were reinterred with great ceremony, attended by King Edward I and his queen, before the High Altar at Glastonbury Abbey, where they were the focus of pilgrimages until the Reformation.

A nearby valley is named the Vale of Avalon.

However, the Glastonbury legend has frequently been perceived as a fraud due, among other things, to the perceived anachronistic inscription which would have been more fitting to the 10th century than the 6th, the lack of any mention of said discovery in the 10th century, which would not have gone unheard of, added to possible ulterior motives from the abbey. Other theories point to Ile Aval, on the coast of Brittany, and Burgh-by-Sands, in Cumberland, which was in Roman times the fort of Aballava on Hadrian's Wall, and near Camboglanna, upwards on the Eden, now Castlesteads. Coincidently, the last battle site of Arthur's campaigns is said to have been named Camlann.


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