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Large 260ft hole in Siberia
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ChrisBoardmanOffline
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PostPosted: 16-07-2014 09:51    Post subject: Large 260ft hole in Siberia Reply with quote

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/travel/travel_news/article-2693105/Giant-hole-appears-Siberia-Huge-crater-emerges-end-world.html

Quote:
Methane explosion? Meteorite crater? Scientists baffled by gigantic 262ft hole that has appeared at Siberia's 'End of The World'

Enormous crater appears suddenly in part of Russia whose name translates as 'the end of the world'
Teams of scientists are rushing east to fathom the cause of this unusual - and rare - geographical occurrence
One especially outlandish theory talks about a UFO landing as a possible cause of this colossal chasm in the earth

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FrideswideOffline
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PostPosted: 16-07-2014 10:25    Post subject: Reply with quote

Whatever it is, think back a few hundred years, or even a few thousand.

What would we think it was? Imagine the myths, legends and folklore that would come!
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ramonmercadoOffline
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PostPosted: 16-07-2014 12:44    Post subject: Reply with quote

Frideswide wrote:
Whatever it is, think back a few hundred years, or even a few thousand.

What would we think it was? Imagine the myths, legends and folklore that would come!


A witch hunt would start and witchs would be found.
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EnolaGaiaOffline
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PostPosted: 16-07-2014 16:31    Post subject: Reply with quote

To judge from the initial photos (such as they are ...) the hole itself looks more like a sinkhole (i.e., some sort of subsidence event). There's no obvious ejecta surrounding the immediate 'crater', so it's hard to believe it was formed by any sort of explosion.

I suspect it represents the collapse of a large permafrost dome / hillock (pingo?). In tundra regions permafrost can extrude upward to form raised domes or mounds, which are typically quite neatly circular.

Under this interpretation, the raised rim limited to the hole's perimeter would be the remains of the mound's periphery rather than material ejected by the hole's creation.
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MythopoeikaOffline
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PostPosted: 16-07-2014 19:43    Post subject: Reply with quote

Another link here with video etc.

http://siberiantimes.com/other/others/features/large-crater-appears-at-the-end-of-the-world/
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markrkingston1Offline
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PostPosted: 16-07-2014 20:51    Post subject: Reply with quote

EnolaGaia wrote:
To judge from the initial photos (such as they are ...) the hole itself looks more like a sinkhole (i.e., some sort of subsidence event). There's no obvious ejecta surrounding the immediate 'crater', so it's hard to believe it was formed by any sort of explosion.

I suspect it represents the collapse of a large permafrost dome / hillock (pingo?). In tundra regions permafrost can extrude upward to form raised domes or mounds, which are typically quite neatly circular.

Under this interpretation, the raised rim limited to the hole's perimeter would be the remains of the mound's periphery rather than material ejected by the hole's creation.


The rim looks very much to me like loose ejected soil.

I too was thinking that it was an ice dome collapse until I saw that the rim was a pile of seemingly ejected material.
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EnolaGaiaOffline
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PostPosted: 20-07-2014 14:29    Post subject: Reply with quote

This news article summarizes what they've found so far. The linked webpage includes a number of photos that illustrate more details than the previous aerial shots. Here are some key excerpts:

Quote:


First pictures from inside the 'crater at the end of the world'

The crater on the Yamal Peninsula was caused by aliens, a meteorite, a stray missile, or an explosive gas cocktail released due to global warming, according to various theories in recent days.

Images of the remarkable phenomenon have gone round the world since The Siberian Times highlighted helicopter images of the giant hole earlier this week.

The first expedition to the scene - the scientists have just returned - took these epic pictures of the hole, including the darkening pattern on the inner rim.

Now they are using Russian satellite pictures to fix the moment when it suddenly formed.

They found the crater - around up to 70 metres deep - has an icy lake at its bottom, and water is cascading down its eroding permafrost walls.

It is not as wide as aerial estimates which suggested between 50 and 100 metres. ...

Andrey Plekhanov, Senior Researcher at the State Scientific Centre of Arctic Research, said: 'The crater has more of an oval than a circular shape, it makes it harder to calculate the exact diameter. As of now our estimates is about thirty metres.

'If we try to measure diameter together with soil emission, the so-called parapet, then the diameter is up to sixty meters.

'The crater is from 50 to 70 metres deep'. ...

He stressed: 'We are working with space photographs to figure out exact time of its formation.

'We have taken soil and ice samples which went straight to laboratories. We can be certain in saying that the crater appeared relatively recently, perhaps a year or two ago; so it is a recent formation, we are not talking about dozen years ago.

'Could it be linked to the global warming? We have to continue our research to answer this question.

'Two previous summers - years 2012 and 2013 were relatively hot for Yamal, perhaps this has somehow influenced the formation of the crater.

'But we have to do our tests and research first and then say it more definitively'. ...

The best theory for now is that the crater was formed by internal - not external - forces.

'For now we can say for sure that under the influence of internal processes there was an ejection in the permafrost. I want to stress that it was not an explosion, but an ejection, so there was no heat released as it happened'. ...


SOURCE: http://siberiantimes.com/science/casestudy/news/first-pictures-from-inside-the-crater-at-the-end-of-the-world/
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Pietro_Mercurios
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PostPosted: 20-07-2014 14:45    Post subject: Reply with quote

Could it have been an explosive release of methane, from frozen methane clathrate, locked in the melting permafrost?
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MythopoeikaOffline
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PostPosted: 20-07-2014 16:05    Post subject: Reply with quote

That is entirely possible, yes.
If methane is jetting out of this hole, someone needs to go in and stick a well-head on top of it. Don't want it to catch fire and end up like that other hole in the ground...
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FrideswideOffline
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PostPosted: 20-07-2014 16:38    Post subject: Reply with quote

er.... what other hole in the ground?

*genuine question* Embarassed
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MythopoeikaOffline
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PostPosted: 20-07-2014 17:09    Post subject: Reply with quote

Frideswide wrote:
er.... what other hole in the ground?

*genuine question* Embarassed


The Door to Hell, of course:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Door_to_Hell

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/65/The_Door_to_Hell.jpg/1024px-The_Door_to_Hell.jpg
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FrideswideOffline
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PostPosted: 20-07-2014 17:35    Post subject: Reply with quote

)(*&&^&*%%^&%%*%! Shocked Shocked Shocked

that's impressive! Shocked

thank you. I think.
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rynner2Offline
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PostPosted: 29-07-2014 14:02    Post subject: Reply with quote

Look out, they're breeding!

Two more mysterious holes discovered in remote Siberia
Researchers want to investigate two more mysterious holes found by reindeer herders in the Siberian wilderness
By Mark Molloy
12:14PM BST 29 Jul 2014

Researchers investigating a mysterious hole in the remote Siberian tundra might be busy over the next few weeks.
Two more formations, which are similar in appearance to the first, have been discovered in different parts of northern Russia.

One of new openings, which has a diameter of around 15 metres, has been found in the Yamal Peninsula, a permafrost region where the first hole appeared.
The second vast opening in the ground was discovered hundreds of kilometres away in the Taymyr Peninsula, to the east.
According to the Siberian Times, both of the holes were discovered by reindeer herders.

The Institute of the Earth Cryosphere has been studying the original giant opening, which is estimated to be 70 metres deep, since July 16.
Chief scientist, Marina Leibman, told URA.RU: “I have heard about the second funnel on Yamal, in Taz district, and saw the pictures.
“Undoubtedly, we need to study all such formations. It is necessary to be able to predict their occurrence.
“Each new funnel provides additional information for scientists.”

Scientists found an icy lake at the bottom of the hole and have taken soil and ice samples to find out when it was formed.
Experts believe it was likely to have been caused by the melting of underground ice in the permafrost, freeing gas that then built up high pressure and broke through to the surface.
A clip of the mysterious hole has been watched more than 7 million times online.

"It's an interesting phenomenon,” said Vladimir Pushkarev, the head of the Russian Centre for Developing the Arctic.
“We are discussing further study of this place. It really is worth continuing scientific work.”

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/russia/10997572/Two-more-mysterious-craters-discovered-in-remote-Siberia.html
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Pietro_Mercurios
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PostPosted: 03-08-2014 09:32    Post subject: Reply with quote

More on the Siberian permafrost methane blowouts.
Quote:
http://thinkprogress.org/climate/2014/08/01/3466466/siberian-craters-permafrost-climate-change/

The Really Scary Thing About Those Jaw-Dropping Siberian Craters

Think Progress (Climate), by Ari Phillips. Posted on August 1, 2014

Russian scientists have determined that a massive crater discovered in a remote part of Siberia was probably caused by thawing permafrost. The crater is in the Yamal Peninsula, which means “end of the world.” It caught hold of the media spotlight in mid-July when it was spotted by oil and gas workers flying over the area. At roughly 200 feet wide and seemingly bottomless, speculation abounded about the cause with the Siberian Times reporting that, “theories range from meteorites, stray missiles, a man-made prank, and aliens, to an explosive cocktail of methane or shale gas suddenly exploding.”

Since this first discovery, two other smaller craters have been spotted in the surrounding regions, fueling even more armchair conjecture. Russian scientists sent to the site are now providing first-hand data showing that unusually high concentrations of methane of up to 9.6 percent were present at the bottom of the first large crater shortly after it was discovered on July 16. Andrei Plekhanov, an archaeologist at the Scientific Centre of Arctic Studies in Salekhard, Russia, who led an expedition to the crater, told The Journal Nature that air normally contains just 0.000179 percent methane.

According to Plekhanov, the last two summers in the Yamal have been exceptionally warm at about nine degrees Fahrenheit above average. Rising temperatures could have allowed the permafrost to thaw and collapse, releasing the methane previously trapped by the subterranean ice. Methane is the primary component of natural gas. The original crater is about 20 miles from a large natural gas plant and the entire Yamal Peninsula is rich in natural gas that is being extensively tapped to help fuel Russia’s natural gas boom.

Hans-Wolfgang Hubberten, a geochemist at the Alfred Wegener Institute in Potsdam, Germany, told Nature that climate change and the slow, steady thaw of the region could be to blame.

“Gas pressure increased until it was high enough to push away the overlying layers in a powerful injection, forming the crater,” he said.
This frame grab made Wednesday, July 16 shows the 200-foot wide crater discovered in the Yamal Peninsula.

While staring down into the abyss of these craters is a scary thought, the release of large quantities of greenhouse gases from melting permafrost is existentially daunting. A study from earlier this year found that melting permafrost soil, which typically remains frozen all year, is thawing and decomposing at an accelerating rate. This is releasing more methane into the atmosphere, causing the greenhouse effect to increase global temperatures and creating a positive feedback loop in which more permafrost melts.

“The world is getting warmer, and the additional release of gas would only add to our problems,” said Jeff Chanton, the John Widmer Winchester Professor of Oceanography at Florida State and researcher on the study. According to Chanton, if the permafrost completely melts, there would be five times the current amount of carbon equivalent in the atmosphere.

Kevin Schaefer, a permafrost scientist at the National Snow and Ice Data Center, told ThinkProgress that there are actually two sources of GHGs released by melting permafrost: methane hydrates that destabilize when permafrost temperatures rise, as has been the case in Siberia, and frozen organic matter.

“Note that the methane hydrate and the decaying organic matter emissions result from two completely different mechanisms,” said Schaefer. “Methane hydrate emissions come from deep permafrost due to purely physical processes. The decaying organic matter emissions come from near-surface permafrost due to purely biological processes.”

He said that as the permafrost thaws, the organic matter will also thaw and begin to decay, releasing CO2 and methane into the atmosphere. “Published estimates indicate 120 gigatons of carbon emissions from thawing permafrost by 2100, which would increase global temperatures by an additional 7.98 percent,” he said.

Schaefer said the phenomenon of the Siberian craters was a surprise to him because he thought the methane would leak out more slowly. Capturing these large bursts of methane before they enter the atmosphere could be possible, according to Schaefer, however extremely difficult.

“The key is drilling into the permafrost before the methane escapes,” he said. “However, creating the infrastructure just to get to these remote locations is daunting.”

He said that capturing the emissions from decaying organic matter would be impossible.

Ted Schuur, a professor of ecosystem ecology at the University of Florida and leader of the Permafrost Carbon Network, told ThinkProgress that the Siberian craters remind him of ‘hot spots’ of methane bubbling that occur both in lakes and undersea in the permafrost zone.

“This could be a terrestrial version that was previously capped by ground ice in permafrost,” he said. “If indeed they are the result of warming permafrost they could be a significant pathway of greenhouse gas release to the atmosphere. As with other processes in the permafrost zone, abrupt changes appear to be as or perhaps more important than slow gradual change.”

A survey of 41 permafrost scientists in 2011 estimated that if human fossil-fuel use remained on a high projection and the planet warmed significantly, gases from permafrost could eventually equal 35 percent of present day annual emissions. In the few years since then, emissions have continued to rise. If emissions are heavily curtailed, greenhouse gases from permafrost could make up as little as around the equivalent of 10 percent of today’s human-caused emissions. This is far lower, but still highly disconcerting.

“Even if it’s 5 or 10 percent of today’s emissions, it’s exceptionally worrying, and 30 percent is humongous,” Josep G. Canadell, a scientist in Australia who runs a global program to monitor greenhouse gases, told the New York Times at the time of the study. “It will be a chronic source of emissions that will last hundreds of years.”

Maybe we now know one of the reasons why the last ice age ended so quickly?
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MythopoeikaOffline
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PostPosted: 03-08-2014 14:08    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very worrying indeed.
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