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rynner2 What a Cad!
Great Old One Joined: 13 Dec 2008 Total posts: 20321 Location: Under the moon Gender: Male |
 Posted: 01-09-2012 08:38 Post subject: |
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Ho hum...
Was Jack the Ripper a cart driver from Bethnal Green?
Two Jack The Ripper experts believe they have found the identity of the Whitechapel serial killer.
9:00PM BST 31 Aug 2012
It has been the subject of macabre speculation for more than 100 years but now two Jack The Ripper experts believe they have found the identity of the Whitechapel serial killer.
Authors Christer Holmgren and Edward Stow believe the most likely suspect for Jack The Ripper is Charles Cross, a cartman who claimed to have found the first victim prostitute Polly Nichols on August 31 1888.
Cross was discovered crouching over the body by a witness Robert Paul.
He told police he had been walking through Bucks Row on his way to Pickfords’ depot in Broad Street at around 3am when he found the body of Nichols.
But Holmgren and Stow believe he could have been the killer, disturbed as he was mutilating the body of Nichols.
And all the subsequent murders took place between his home in Doveton Street in Bethnal Green and his work at Broad Street at times when he would have been walking to work.
Mr Stow said: "We think it Charles Cross, the first person who found that first body. He was seen crouching over Polly Nichols and he wast trying to cover up some of the wounds.
"He hasn't been the subject of a lot of investigation and has only crept up very vaguely in census records.
"We have found out that he gave a false name to the police. His real name was Charles Latchmere.
"The police at the time were looking for some sort of special individual. But most crimes turn out to be someone quite ordinary.
"He walked past every single murder scene on his way to work. He is the best suspect so far."
Mary Ann "Polly" Nichols was attacked as she walked home from a night walking the Whitechapel Road.
Her throat was slit twice from left to right and her body mutilated.
The body of second Ripper victim, Annie Chapman, was found on September 8 in the back yard of 29 Hanbury Street, Spitalfields. Her abdomen was slashed entirely open, and it was later discovered that the uterus had been removed.
Elizabeth Stride and Catherine Eddowes were killed in the early morning of Sunday 30 September 1888.
Eddowes' body was found in Mitre Square, in the City of London, three-quarters of an hour after Stride's. The throat was severed, and the abdomen was ripped open by a long, deep, jagged wound. The left kidney and the major part of the uterus had been removed.
The final victim, Mary Jane Kelly was discovered lying on the bed in the single room where she lived at 13 Miller's Court off Dorset Street, Spitalfields on November 9 1888. The throat had been severed down to the spine, and the abdomen virtually emptied of its organs. Even her heart was missing.
The removal of the organs led the police to suspect he was an educated upper-class man, possibly a doctor or an aristocrat. Suggestions for the culprit included Prince Albert Victor, the grandson of Queen Victoria, and Sir William Gull, the Queen's doctor.
Holmgren and Stow made the claims on the anniversary of the first murder at a re-enactment in Bethnal Green.
Cross died in 1920 and was survived by his wife who eventually passed away on 12 September 1940 in Stratford.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/9512928/Was-Jack-the-Ripper-a-cart-driver-from-Bethnal-Green.html
Right, now that's sorted we can close the thread and get on to something more interesting....  |
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| JamesWhitehead Piffle Prospector Joined: 02 Aug 2001 Total posts: 5543 Location: Manchester, UK Gender: Male |
| Posted: 01-09-2012 10:34 Post subject: |
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Well at least he wasn't someone famous!
I don't think I've encountered his name before. Perhaps he is one of the unknown pair mentioned on this page, which gives a good idea of the sort of work which went on in those days:
Night-working horse-slaughterers  |
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| ramonmercado Psycho Punk
Joined: 19 Aug 2003 Total posts: 17657 Location: Dublin Gender: Male |
| Posted: 01-09-2012 12:50 Post subject: |
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| JamesWhitehead wrote: | Well at least he wasn't someone famous!
I don't think I've encountered his name before. Perhaps he is one of the unknown pair mentioned on this page, which gives a good idea of the sort of work which went on in those days:
Night-working horse-slaughterers |
Makes a change to have an ordinary person blamed. |
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| PeniG Proud children's writer Joined: 31 Dec 2003 Total posts: 2902 Location: San Antonio, Texas Age: 52 Gender: Female |
| Posted: 01-09-2012 15:51 Post subject: |
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| But if it was him, and he didn't die till 1920 - why did he stop doing it? And what about all the other nameless, faceless people walking by all those murder sites during the same period? Given what a small town Whitechapel was, geographically, for the large number of people crammed into it, all of them must have been on the regular routes of a lot of folks. |
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| ramonmercado Psycho Punk
Joined: 19 Aug 2003 Total posts: 17657 Location: Dublin Gender: Male |
| Posted: 01-09-2012 20:30 Post subject: |
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| PeniG wrote: | | But if it was him, and he didn't die till 1920 - why did he stop doing it? And what about all the other nameless, faceless people walking by all those murder sites during the same period? Given what a small town Whitechapel was, geographically, for the large number of people crammed into it, all of them must have been on the regular routes of a lot of folks. |
According to the programme he contracted TB and was weakened as a result. |
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| Ravenstone I suffer bad press in Genesis. I may sue...
The Original Sin Joined: 01 Aug 2001 Total posts: 6073 Location: Outside the Garden of Eden, with my flamin' sword Gender: Unknown |
| Posted: 02-09-2012 19:26 Post subject: |
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| How does that fit in with the two men who found the body and ran off to find a policeman, and the policeman who found the body while they were off looking for a policeman? (proving the theory that coppers are like buses, of course) |
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| Zilch5 Vogon Poet
Great Old One Joined: 08 Nov 2007 Total posts: 1463 Location: Western Sydney, Australia Gender: Male |
| Posted: 04-10-2012 11:11 Post subject: |
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Ok, let's now move from the purely speculative to the completely bonkers:
Vincent Van Gogh was Jack the Ripper
The proof is in his painting "The Irises" - and these three short youtube videos will no doubt convince you of the veracity of this claim:
http://youtu.be/f8fNwbdKQy8
http://youtu.be/clOPwt4UD8E
http://youtu.be/At_Gq19K-V0
And did I mention he's selling a book about this "discovery"? 
This is getting worse. I am starting to think JTR was Mother Theresa - she WAS pretty old and looked a bit like a man...
Last edited by Zilch5 on 05-10-2012 00:03; edited 1 time in total |
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| Monstrosa Joined: 07 Feb 2007 Total posts: 480 |
| Posted: 04-10-2012 12:49 Post subject: |
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That guy is... is.... totally utterly hatstand.
Vincent and the Doctor was more believable. |
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| theyithian Keeping the British end up
Joined: 29 Oct 2002 Total posts: 11649 Location: Vermilion Sands Gender: Unknown |
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| JamesWhitehead Piffle Prospector Joined: 02 Aug 2001 Total posts: 5543 Location: Manchester, UK Gender: Male |
| Posted: 12-05-2013 08:58 Post subject: |
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No Jack D. Ripper on the list, though!
It is a somewhat strange list, to be sure!
I clicked on Big Nose George to find a story of the Wild West I had not heard. Quite grotesque post-mortem details for the morbidly-inclined - which I suppose covers most readers of this thread!  |
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| kamalktk Great Old One Joined: 05 Feb 2011 Total posts: 634 Gender: Unknown |
| Posted: 12-05-2013 12:19 Post subject: |
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| JamesWhitehead wrote: |
I clicked on Big Nose George to find a story of the Wild West I had not heard. Quite grotesque post-mortem details for the morbidly-inclined - which I suppose covers most readers of this thread! |
I kind of want to see the shoes now. |
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| Spudrick68 Great Old One Joined: 08 Jun 2008 Total posts: 1096 Location: sunny Morecambe Age: 45 Gender: Male |
| Posted: 13-05-2013 21:42 Post subject: |
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| And the medical bag. |
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| theyithian Keeping the British end up
Joined: 29 Oct 2002 Total posts: 11649 Location: Vermilion Sands Gender: Unknown |
| Posted: 19-05-2013 07:18 Post subject: |
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| Zoffre wrote: | Yesterday I went to see the Jack the Ripper exhibition at the London Docklands museum mentioned above (and also here). I'm not overly familiar with the cases, but I'd say the exhibition is good for getting a general overview. There's particular focus on the social deprivation and general milieu in which the murders were carried out, which aids general understanding. There are also plenty of contemporary accounts, evidence etc, as well as current theories on subjects such as prostitution in general, whether the murderer/murderers were surgeons etc. (including a Feminist perspective from Bonnie Greer, which I'm afraid I found very unconvincing, but nevertheless interesting). The only area where I found it lacking was in the suspects - I would have liked more about how they came to be considered as suspects, arguments for and against etc. because I felt that area was glossed over towards the end.
Otherwise, an interesting exhibition. And the rest of the museum is worth a look too.  |
If anyone is interested, the Rippercast covers the exhibition in depth:
The consensus among the ripperologist-panel is that the exhibition missed the point by omitting the biographies of the victims - and everyone, in fact.
The core criticism is that the exhibition was really an 'East End lives' exhibition hung on a Ripper-hook.
http://www.casebook.org/podcast/listen.html?id=67 |
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| sherbetbizarre Great Old One Joined: 04 Sep 2004 Total posts: 1344 Gender: Male |
| Posted: 06-08-2013 00:45 Post subject: |
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| Quote: | Jack the Ripper’s letter should go on show, Assembly urges Scotland Yard
Scotland Yard is under pressure to put crime artefacts including a letter from Jack the Ripper on public display.
The infamous “letter from hell” taunting police said to have been sent by the killer with half a human kidney from a victim at the height of the 1888 Whitechapel Murders is among a collection of evidence which has remained hidden from the public.
But putting them on show for three months could earn the Met Police a cool £4 million, say London Assembly members.
“It could attract 300,000 people from all over the world,” said a Tory Group spokesman.
“Scotland Yard is holding a lot of historical items which should be on public show, yet have always claimed the items are too gruesome.”
But Scotland Yard wouldn’t be drawn on the idea. A spokesman said today: “Assembly members have suggested we put on a roadshow. We haven’t responded to that idea.”
Such an exhibition would include items currently accessible only by invitation such as the Ripper letter sent with the kidney parcel to George Luske. Other items would include evidence against the Great Train Robbers.
Historical researcher Edward Stow, who has been investigating a new suspect in the Whitechapel Murders, backs the idea of a public exhibition.
He said: “London seems to be embarrassed with talking about the Ripper—but it brings tourists from all over the world and we should capitalise on it.
“Jack the Ripper is part of the fabric of London and the East End. We can look at it dispassionately because 125 years on is a fair distance of time.
“If they had been in Paris or particularly New York, they wouldn’t be ashamed of it.”
The items could be put on display when the Met moves from New Scotland Yard in 2015, it is suggested.
Assembly members are urging The Met to open its infamous ‘Black Museum’ collection to the public and use the profits for policing London. |
East London Advertiser |
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| Cochise Great Old One Joined: 17 Jun 2011 Total posts: 989 Location: Gwynedd, Wales Age: 57 Gender: Male |
| Posted: 06-08-2013 08:23 Post subject: |
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Oh great. I bet that would be really tasteful - not.
My wife had seen the 'Black Museum', she being blessed with an insatiable curiosity and the sort of persistence and charm that got her places you don't normally get to go.
She reckoned a) it was a lot less interesting that you'd think and b) it's all in a quite small room, not particularly laid out for display.
Very little of it has anything to do with JtR, either. If there was such a person. |
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