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witchflame BRING OUT YOUR DEAD!
Great Old One Joined: 13 Aug 2005 Total posts: 217 Location: Down the back of the sofa with lord lucan, an undiscovered shakespearian sonnet and 10p Gender: Female |
 Posted: 20-03-2006 16:45 Post subject: |
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I think if someone is barking enough to say 'god made me do it', god told me to do it' or words to that effect, whatever race colour or creed, they should be given double the sentence for their crime. They are obviously as mad as cheese, and likely to go on another bender if left to their own devices and let off. I think you 'd find a few less pleas to that effect if they knew what blaming god would bring and were sane enough to know they are talking B*****ks.  |
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| Mighty_Emperor Divine Wind
Joined: 18 Aug 2002 Total posts: 19943 Location: Mongo Age: 42 Gender: Male |
| Posted: 14-04-2006 16:56 Post subject: |
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Is God in the brain?
| Quote: | April 1, 2006, 12:00AM
Accused baby killer has tumor
Defense says mass in her brain could have led to the severing of infant's arms
By THOMAS KOROSEC
Copyright 2006 Houston Chronicle
MCKINNEY - A mother accused of severing the arms of her 10-month-old daughter has a brain tumor that could have caused the psychotic hallucinations her defense says led to the killing, a Collin County Jail psychiatrist testified Friday.
The cancerous tumor in the middle of Dena Schlosser's brain and its possible effects were not part of the 37-year-old Plano woman's capital murder trial in February, which ended with a deadlocked jury and a mistrial.
At a hearing Friday, Schlosser waived her right to a jury trial. She will allow state District Judge Chris Oldner to decide the case. Oldner said he will render his verdict April 7 after reviewing transcripts of the first trial.
During seven days of testimony in February, three psychiatrists testified that Schlosser was mentally ill, did not know right from wrong and therefore was legally insane when she cut off the arms of her infant daughter, Maggie, in a crib in the family's apartment in November 2004.
Jurors heard only a brief mention of a possible tumor in testimony from Dr. Joseph Black, who treated Schlosser at the North Texas State Hospital in Vernon after she was sent there after a February 2005 ruling that she was incompetent to stand trial.
David Haynes, Schlosser's attorney, said he knew little about the tumor at the time of the trial and did not make the matter part of his case.
At Friday's hearing, Dr. Xiaoyan Wu, Collin County's jail psychiatrist, testified that a counselor at the jail had kept Black's records locked in a desk until three weeks ago.
After reviewing them, Wu said she instructed a neurologist to give Schlosser an MRI. It revealed a lesion in the right middle part of Schlosser's brain, the doctor said.
Wu said it is possible the tumor created a condition known as peduncular hallucinosis, with symptoms such as vivid, recurring hallucinations, sleep disorders and problems with motor skills.
Testimony in the first trial showed that several times in the year before the killing Schlosser had religious-based hallucinations and delusions that she thought God wanted her to kill the child.
In jail, Schlosser once lost her balance, fell and fractured a bone, Wu said.
Wu said that while Schlosser's hallucinations were consistent with a brain tumor, she was not certain that they were directly linked.
Haynes said after the hearing that he believes Black's records were mislaid by the Collin County Jail counselor by mistake. "These things happen," he said.
Collin County prosecutor Curtis Howard said Black's records were available to both sides and were admitted into evidence in the case.
"It was Dr. Wu who didn't know about it because she was a witness and not in the courtroom," he said.
Howard said the recent MRI revealed more about the mass in Schlosser's brain than had been in Black's records.
Wu testified that Schlosser is currently not receiving treatment for the tumor. A neurosurgeon needs to be called in to evaluate her, Wu said.
Haynes said he was confident that Oldner would see the case as 11 of the 12 jurors saw it last month. Only one held out for conviction.
Both sides agreed not to present evidence to the judge that was not presented in the first trial. But they did so only after Wu took the stand and testified about Schlosser's brain tumor.
Haynes said the judge can take that into consideration as he decides the case.
If convicted, Schlosser would face life in prison. If acquitted by reason of insanity, she likely will be sent to a state mental hospital for treatment. |
www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/metropolitan/3763454.html
And the verdict:
| Quote: | Texas Mom Not Guilty by Reason of Insanity
By JULIA GLICK, Associated Press Writer Sat Apr 8, 6:54 AM ET
McKINNEY, Texas - A mother charged with murder for cutting off her baby daughter's arms in what her lawyers portrayed as a religious frenzy was found not guilty by reason of insanity Friday by a judge.
ADVERTISEMENT
Dena Schlosser, 38, will be sent to a state mental hospital and held until she is no longer deemed a threat to herself or others.
"My own expectation is that she will remain at the hospital for many, many years," defense attorney David Haynes said.
Police arrested Schlosser in 2004 after she told a 911 operator she had severed her baby's arms. Officers found the 10-month-old baby, Margaret, near death in her crib and Schlosser covered in blood, holding a knife and listening to a hymn.
In issuing the verdict, Judge Chris Oldner said Schlosser had met the legal standard for insanity, but did not elaborate. Both the defense and the prosecution had agreed to let the judge decide the case after Schlosser's previous trial ended in a deadlocked jury in February.
Last week it was disclosed that Schlosser had a brain tumor that defense attorneys said could have caused hallucinations.
Schlosser glanced toward her former stepfather but said nothing as she was led away.
"We have a just verdict in a just case, but yes, it is bittersweet," her lawyer said. "She feels it is her best chance to get better."
The case hinged on whether Schlosser was unable to grasp the wrongfulness of the crime — the Texas standard for insanity.
The judge relied on evidence he had heard during the first trial. Among other things, psychiatrists said Schlosser suffered severe mood swings and religious hallucinations. One doctor said Schlosser told him she wanted to cut off her baby's arms and her own limbs and head and give them to God.
But prosecutor Curtis Howard said the fact Schlosser told her husband that she had "killed the baby" proved she knew what she was doing. "This is a case that could have gone both ways; we knew that," Howard said after the verdict.
Schlosser's brain tumor did not become an issue until last week. A witness in her first trial alluded to a possible brain lesion, but miscommunication between doctors delayed confirmation by a neurologist until weeks after the mistrial.
Bob Nicholas, Schlosser's former stepfather and the only relative in attendance Friday, said the verdict was the best possible outcome.
"This whole case, this whole situation with Dena, was a tragedy," Nicholas said. "We've got the loss of Maggie, who never reached her first birthday. We've got two little girls coping with the loss of their sister and of a loving, caring mother."
John Schlosser, Schlosser's husband, has filed for divorce and has custody of the couple's two other daughters.
In another similar Texas case, a jury rejected an insanity defense in 2002 from Andrea Yates, the Houston mother who drowned her five children in the bathtub. She won a new trial on appeal and will again use an insanity defense in June.
In 2004 in East Texas, Deanna Laney was acquitted by reason of insanity after killing her 6- and 8-year-old sons by bashing their skulls with rocks. |
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060408/ap_on_re_us/severed_arms |
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| Mighty_Emperor Divine Wind
Joined: 18 Aug 2002 Total posts: 19943 Location: Mongo Age: 42 Gender: Male |
| Posted: 28-04-2006 00:34 Post subject: |
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| Quote: | Father: God Told Me To Sacrifice Wife, Children
POSTED: 8:02 am EDT April 26, 2006
UPDATED: 11:52 am EDT April 26, 2006
A man sentenced to 90 years in prison for attempting to set his Orlando home on fire with his family sleeping inside said God commanded him to sacrifice his wife and children, according to a Local 6 News report.
Hans Missal, 51, admitted to dousing his Orlando home with gasoline last March. Missal also duct-taped the doors shut and ran a hose from the house to a car tailpipe while his wife, son and daughter slept before he attempted to set the structure on fire.
Tuesday, Missal said he was following God's orders.
Missal compared himself to the Bible's Abraham, who was commanded by God to sacrifice his own son, and said he received a message from God to kill his entire family, Local 6 News reported.
"God had a plan for my family, I had no idea what that plan was," Missal said. "I trusted God and God was faithful to the end."
Missal said God stopped the sacrifice by waking up the family before he set the house on fire.
"I know that God was putting me through a test," Missal said. "He said, 'Do you love your family?' And absolutely, I love them more than anything in this world."
"Missal understands why people may think he is mentally ill," Local 6 reporter Mike DeForest said. "But he said it was all God's plan for him to serve the next 90 years in prison."
He also said it was God's plan for his wife and children to endure such mental anguish.
"I know too many children who have easy lives and they suffer for that," Missal said.
"So, this was to make your kid stronger?" DeForest said.
"It was not to make my kid stronger, but they will be stronger because of it," Missal said.
Missal is leading a Bible study group at jail.
He will soon be transported to state prison, where he plans to spend time praying.
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Watch Local 6 News for more on this story.
Copyright 2006 by Internet Broadcasting Systems and Local6.com. |
www.local6.com/news/9009375/detail.html |
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| Anonymous |
| Posted: 28-04-2006 08:21 Post subject: |
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Interesting point re: is god in the brain. From BBC.CO.UK/SCIENCE
| Quote: | God on the Brain - questions and answers
What are the temporal lobes of the brain?
The temporal lobe controls hearing, speech and memory. The brain has two temporal lobes, one on each side of the brain, located near the ears. The two are interchangeable so if one is damaged the other is usually able to take over the other's function.
What is temporal lobe epilepsy?
It is a condition in which the patient suffers repeated seizures when there is abnormal electrical activity in the temporal lobes of the brain. These seizures may be simple partial seizures without loss of awareness or they can be complex partial seizures with loss of awareness. The patient loses awareness during a complex partial seizure because the seizure spreads to both lobes, causing memory loss. The condition was first recognised in 1881.
What percentage of patients with temporal lobe epilepsy suffer from religious hallucinations?
It is difficult to say because unless the doctor brings up the subject directly with the patient, they may never know if the patient has religious hallucinations. Estimates vary between 10 and 70% , but most neurologists believe only a minority of patients with temporal lobe epilepsy suffer from hallucinations.
Are scientists arguing that all religious experiences can be related to temporal lobe epilepsy?
Not at all. While studies have clearly shown a relationship between religious experience and temporal lobe epilepsy. This does not explain all religious experience by any means. Religious and spiritual experiences are highly complex, involving emotions, thoughts, sensations and behaviours. But scientists do believe that patients with temporal lobe epilepsy, who experience religious hallucinations may provide a valuable model in showing how certain types of religious experience effect the human brain.
Does this work suggest there is a specific 'god spot' in the brain?
Although the temporal lobes are clearly important in religious experience, they are not the whole story. Already the work of Dr Andrew Newberg has shown that a part of the brain called parietal lobes are important. Additionally, very different patterns of brain activity may appear, depending on the particular experience the individual is having. For example, a near death experience might result in different activity patterns from those found in a person who is meditating. Scientists now believe that a number of structures in the brain need to work together to help us experience spirituality and religion.
Are we 'hardwired' for god?
The term 'hardwired' suggests that we were purposefully designed that way. Neuroscience can't answer that question. However what it can say is that the brain does seem to predisposed towards a belief in spiritual and religious matters. The big mystery is how and why this came about.
How does Dr Persinger induce artificially religious experiences in his patients?
Dr Persinger has designed a helmet that produces a very weak rotating magnetic field of between ten nanotesla and one microtesla over the temporal lobes of the brain. This is placed on the subject's head and they are placed in a quiet chamber while blindfolded. So that there is no risk of 'suggestion', the only information that the subjects are given is that they are going in for a relaxation experiment. Neither the subject nor the experimenter carrying out the test has any idea of the true purpose of the experiment. In addition to this, the experiment is also run with the field switched both off and on. This procedure Dr Persinger claims will induce an experience in over 80% of test subjects.
What sort of experiences do subjects report?
This is very dependent on the belief system of the individual subjects. Dr Persinger talks about his subjects feeling a 'sensed presence' - feeling that somebody was in the chamber with them. Subjects who are strongly religious are likely to interpret this presence as god. Whereas, atheists may also report a 'sensed presence' but attribute the phenomena to a trick of brain chemistry, perhaps comparable to when they have taken drugs in the past.
Could it be there is a genetic component to religious belief?
Religious behaviour is so complex it is very unlikely that there will be a single gene for religious activity, but it does seem as if there is some sort of as yet unidentified genetic component. Several studies of identical twins separated at birth and brought up separately have measured religiosity. Religiosity is defined as the intensity of religious belief. These studies have shown that there appears to be about a 50% component to religiosity.
Clearly, what religion you are brought up in is largely dependent upon the culture into which you are born, but what appears to have a significant genetic component is your level of religious intensity.
Will any of this research ever be able to establish whether god exists or not?
Whether god exists or not is something that neuroscience cannot answer. For example, if we take a brain image of a person when they are looking at a picture, we will see various parts of the brain being activated, such as the visual cortex. But the brain image cannot tell us whether or not there is actually a picture 'out there' or whether the person is creating the picture in their own mind. To a certain degree, we all create our own sense of reality. Getting to what is real is the tricky part.
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| Mighty_Emperor Divine Wind
Joined: 18 Aug 2002 Total posts: 19943 Location: Mongo Age: 42 Gender: Male |
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| Mythopoeika Boring petty conservative
Joined: 18 Sep 2001 Total posts: 9109 Location: Not far from Bedford Gender: Unknown |
| Posted: 30-04-2006 10:50 Post subject: |
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I've always been baffled by this.
When these people get 'voices in the head', don't they ever stop to question the whole thing? I mean, they make the assumption that it's God telling them to do these awful things. What makes them think it's not the Devil?  |
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| BlackRiverFalls I wear a fez now.
Joined: 03 Aug 2003 Total posts: 8716 Location: The Attic of Blinky Lights Age: 44 Gender: Female |
| Posted: 30-04-2006 12:45 Post subject: |
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| I don't think it's necessarily in the nature of mental illness to be able to be circumspect about such things at the time that they're happening, and i guess too that within a certain religious background/culture/upbringing, there's a certain acceptability to having 'god' talk to you, rather than perhaps 'the devil' or 'aliens'. |
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| PeniG Proud children's writer Joined: 31 Dec 2003 Total posts: 2920 Location: San Antonio, Texas Age: 52 Gender: Female |
| Posted: 30-04-2006 18:53 Post subject: |
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Sometimes they do think it's the devil, Myth. You're likely to resist doing what you're told much longer if you think the devil's talking to you than if you think it's God.
The thing to remember is that, by definition, mental and emotional illness involves a disruption of the normal processes of the brain. Even if you accept that some of these cases might involve possession by an independent entity, a fully functional, normal brain would be a hindrance to possession. These experiences involve a total breakdown of your relationship to reality. You no more react rationally to the voices in your head than you do to circumstances in a dream - think of all the things you've done in a dream state which on waking made no sense at all and are even reprehensible!
The more self-aware you are, the more likely you are to get assistance before the worst happens, but what if the people you ask assistance of don't actually grasp what you're trying to communicate? What if you're hearing voices in a culture that treats the Bible as if it were literally true? God and devils both speak to people in the Bible, and frankly they aren't that easy to tell apart!
Mundane, sane, practical people may not understand what you're going through at all. Mary Lamb, the innovative and intelligent children's author who also, acting as hostess for her brother Charles, presided over the most popular evening gatherings of Romantic Era London (where "conversation was the champagne"), was very self-aware, and in the days before her prominence she told her family many times that looking after her invalid mother and aunt, her father, both her brothers, and the family sewing business was getting to be too much for her. Her parents' solution was to get her an apprentice - a nine-year-old girl away from home for the first time. This added bit of stress proved too much, and Miss Lamb found herself chasing the child around the dinner table with a carving knife until her mother yelled at her, at which point she turned around and plunged the knife into her own mother's chest.
After that point, people started taking her seriously when she said she couldn't cope, and she never had another violent episode. But it was a little late for her mother then! |
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| ramonmercado Psycho Punk
Joined: 19 Aug 2003 Total posts: 17933 Location: Dublin Gender: Male |
| Posted: 28-02-2007 20:24 Post subject: When God Sanctions Killing, The People Listen |
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Some interestng findings in the March issue of Psychological Science suggest a link between scripture and violence.
| Quote: | When God Sanctions Killing, The People Listen
Main Category: Psychology / Psychiatry News
Article Date: 28 Feb 2007 - 7:00 PST
New research published in the March issue of Psychological Science may help elucidate the relationship between religious indoctrination and violence, a topic that has gained renewed notoriety in the wake of the September 11th terrorist attacks. In the article, University of Michigan psychologist Brad Bushman and his colleagues suggest that scriptural violence sanctioned by God can increase aggression, especially in believers.
The authors set out to examine this interaction by conducting experiments with undergraduates at two religiously contrasting universities: Brigham Young University where 99% of students report believing in God and the Bible and Vrije Universiteit in Amsterdam where just 50% report believing in God and 27% believe in the bible.
After reporting their religious affiliation and beliefs, the participants read a parable adapted from a relatively obscure passage in the King James Bible describing the brutal torture and murder of a woman, and her husband's subsequent revenge on her attackers. Half of the participants were told that the passage came from the Book of Judges in the Old Testament while the other half were told it was an ancient scroll discovered in an archaeological expedition.
In addition to the scriptural distinction, half of the participants from both the bible and the ancient scroll groups read an adjusted version that included the verse:
"The Lord commanded Israel to take arms against their brothers and chasten them before the LORD."
The participants were then placed in pairs and instructed to compete in a simple reaction task. The winner of the task would be able to "blast" his or her partner with noise up to 105 decibels, about the same volume as a fire alarm. The test measures aggression.
As expected, the Brigham Young students were more aggressive (i.e. louder) with their blasts if they had been told that the passage they had previously read was from the bible rather than a scroll. Likewise, participants were more aggressive if they had read the additional verse that depicts God sanctioning violence.
At the more secular Vrije Universiteit, the results were surprisingly similar. Although Vrije students were less likely to be influenced by the source of the material, they blasted more aggressively when the passage that they read included the sanctioning of the violence by God. This finding held true even for non-believers, though to a lesser extent.
The research sheds light on the possible origins of violent religious fundamentalism and falls in line with theories proposed by scholars of religious terrorism, who hypothesize that exposure to violent scriptures may induce extremists to engage in aggressive actions. "To the extent religious extremists engage in prolonged, selective reading of the scriptures, focusing on violent retribution toward unbelievers instead of the overall message of acceptance and understanding," writes Bushman "one might expect to see increased brutality"
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Psychological Science is ranked among the top 10 general psychology journals for impact by the Institute for Scientific Information.
Contact: Brad Bushman
Association for Psychological Science
http://www.psychologicalscience.org/
http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/medicalnews.php?newsid=63847 |
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| lupinwick Joined: 24 Sep 2005 Total posts: 1883 |
| Posted: 28-02-2007 22:25 Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | The research sheds light on the possible origins of violent religious fundamentalism and falls in line with theories proposed by scholars of religious terrorism, who hypothesize that exposure to violent scriptures may induce extremists to engage in aggressive actions. "To the extent religious extremists engage in prolonged, selective reading of the scriptures, focusing on violent retribution toward unbelievers instead of the overall message of acceptance and understanding," writes Bushman "one might expect to see increased brutality" |
So, after the next high school massacre, we can add religious texts to the usual list of problems in society which are blamed?
Presumably exposure to violence in games, films or other literature could give a similar effect? |
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| PeniG Proud children's writer Joined: 31 Dec 2003 Total posts: 2920 Location: San Antonio, Texas Age: 52 Gender: Female |
| Posted: 28-02-2007 23:18 Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | blasted more aggressively when the passage that they read included the sanctioning of the violence by God. This finding held true even for non-believers, though to a lesser extent. |
This indicates that specifically God-sanctioned violence is the bigger problem. You'd have to test this against other violence in media. For instance, is the violence committed by the Captain in Pan's Labyrinth less inspirational than the violence Mercedes uses against him in self-defense? Or does the overall dark tone of this movie dampen this behavioral effect? Is the effect different is you see the entire movie or only specific scenes; say the Captain's murder of the poachers? Are either of the scenes mentioned mitigated if viewed isolated from each other but in company with the scene in which Ofelia refuses to let the faun let her baby brother's blood? Does it matter what order the scenes are shown in? Is there a difference in effect between material from a scripture, from a political leader, and from a religious leader?
Do the age and sex of the subject matter? Do print, film, audio-only, visual-only, comic book, and game material have different effects? Do different translations of the same passage (say, King James vs. a paraphrase with more mundane language and a duller style) have measurable differences in effect?
This is just the preliminary groundwork. People are always making huge claims about the effects of media on the fragile psyches of other people, and they seldom to never have anything resembling proper scientific backup. Nor will any scientific work that doesn't match expectations be allowed to affect public policy, while pseudoscientific work which confirms prejudice will be used as the excuse for all sorts of excesses. |
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| rjmrjmrjm Professional Surrealist
Constipated-Philosopher Joined: 25 Feb 2004 Total posts: 1465 Location: Behind your eyes... Gender: Unknown |
| Posted: 01-03-2007 02:35 Post subject: |
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| I find the article title misleading. It isn't God sanctioning the violence is it really? It's someone who's written something. Unless you're a biblical-literalist God doesn't = Bible. |
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| lupinwick Joined: 24 Sep 2005 Total posts: 1883 |
| Posted: 01-03-2007 13:20 Post subject: |
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| So seeing as we have ratings for films etc. based on levels of violence, sex etc. can I suggest we do the same for the various works of scripture? Keep the evil Bible and Koran (and any other work of scripture) away from the eyes of the young. |
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| Dingo667 I'm strange...but true Joined: 27 Aug 2004 Total posts: 1977 Location: Deep in the Fens, UK Age: 46 Gender: Female |
| Posted: 02-03-2007 12:32 Post subject: |
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Any belief should be kept from young and influential minds until they have finished growing and can make up their own minds, using some of thier life experiences.
If you are young, you are gullible as you have not much to compare anything to. Whatever your parents say counts as they are imprinted in your mind from birth onwards. If parents tell you to read religious texts and believe in them you have been caught.
The texts themselves then strengthen a childs belief in them further by using circular reinforcement [i.e "If you don't believe, you are going to be punished or if you don't see sense in these scripts you have been led astray by satan or whoever is the arch enemy].
I remember as a child believing a lot, fortunately I am stubborn and as I grew up my scientific mind took over and I wouldn't believe anything unless it makes sense.
Religious books should have a rating of 18 and it should be illegal to teach anything from them to young minds, punishable by either hefty fines or prison. |
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| graylien Great Old One Location: Norwich - home of the Puppet Man! Age: 42 Gender: Male |
| Posted: 05-03-2007 11:22 Post subject: |
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| Short of locking a child in a box until they're 18, I don't see how you could possibly shield them from "any belief". Should history teachers be banned from covering the role of organised religion in history? Should works of fiction which make reference to religious beliefs also be banned? And what about Aborigines or Native Americans - should they also be prevented from sharing their traditional spiritual beliefs with their offspring? Or is it merely Christianity that you wish to stamp out? |
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