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Moon Landing - Hoaxed?
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rynner2Offline
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PostPosted: 26-01-2011 22:03    Post subject: Reply with quote

dannycheveaux1 wrote:
I would love to 100% believe they got there safely AND came back.
I remember watching in awe the live broadcasts from the moon when I was a kid, viewing the returned capsule from a couple of feet away on it's world tour and peering at the tiny bits of moon dust in the sealed glass globe display case - now I have serious doubts!
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/8226075.stm

That story was posted on this thread a couple of years ago, here:
http://www.forteantimes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=900811#900811

(With comments in subsequent posts. Gawd, I feel like I'm stuck in a time warp! Rolling Eyes )
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Bigfoot73Offline
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PostPosted: 26-01-2011 22:46    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
In fact, it's fecking ridiculous!


In all my , well, 18 months or so on FTMB that's the first time I've seen Rynner get het up about something !

And why not, the most irritating thing about anything Fortean is the way myths and misconceptions never seem to just give up and go away. Apollo 12, an identical craft to 11, landed in November 1969. What could have been so drastically wrong with 11 that necessitated any fakery that was OK with 12? Hoax believers have never proposed a single reason for the hoax that couldn't be applied to all the Apollo missions, yet nobody has ever claimed they were all faked.
Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter sent back plenty of photos of 11 on the Moon, not in the Area 51 sound stage.
If you care to check out the Apollo Image Libraries on the NASA website you will find photos of East Crater . There shouldn't be any. Neil Armstrong took 3 minutes out of the schedule to walk the 150 yards to it and take the pics without telling Mission Control. NASA developed and released the photos before they realised there were more of them than they expected. So, was NASA faking autonomous actions by astronauts too?
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Dingo667Offline
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PostPosted: 27-01-2011 16:00    Post subject: Reply with quote

rynner2 wrote:
Dingo667 wrote:
Yes they landed eventually. I still doubt they did it the first time though, for a lot of reasons. Case open again. Cool

So which Apollo was the first to 'really' land?

And what's your evidence?

Frankly, I can't believe that two other astronauts have happily left Armstrong and Aldrin claiming to have been the first men to land on the moon if it wasn't true.

In fact, it's fecking ridiculous! Twisted Evil



Shhhh Rynner, shhhh....deep breath...better Wink
I can be a stirrer sometimes, I believe myself a devils advocate only with things that are in my mind not as 'sorted' as some believe. The moon landings are one of those things. I also believe myself quite rational but in order for me to close a file I personally have top be 100% convinced.
Now chemtrails are one of those that I happily close and never read about again because every information I have looked at shows blatantly that those white trails are contrails. End off...for me.
Orbs are another.
I personally would also include alien abduction.

But there are other theories where my niggling doubts just will not rest, mainly because the 'against' arguments seem as thin as the 'for' arguments. None of the sides have totally convinced me yet and until they do I will play devils advocate because I need something more.
Under these fall the moon landings, 9/11 and some other 'minor' conspiracies.
I am truly happy if for some here the case is closed, its your right to believe whatever you want but as to myself, the case is not closed and I won't give any reasons because a) it will be too long, b) It will be something already discussed [albeit not to my satisfaction] and c) I don't feel like it.
Getting angry because I have these opinions helps exactly whom?
The guy who believes in his chemtrails is also welcome to his opinion but I won't get angry about it...bored yes but angry, no. Maybe he will prove us all wrong one day.

That is another reason, if I listed why I still won't close the moon files all of you who have made up your mind will get bored and the argument will go round in endless circles. I can't convince you and you [or anyone else] have definitely not managed to convince me....yet!

Peace smokin
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jimv1Offline
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PostPosted: 27-01-2011 20:17    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've said it once and I'll say it again. The US Apollo missions were as much political as they were exploratory. With the Cold War going on, do you think the Russians may have said something if they thought it was a fake?

Also there's the rocks.

Quote:


The oldest Moon rocks are up to 4.5 billion years old, making them 200 million years older than the oldest Earth rocks, which are from the Hadean eon and dated 3.8 to 4.3 billion years ago. The rocks returned by Apollo are very close in composition to the samples returned by the independent Soviet Luna programme.
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rynner2Offline
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PostPosted: 27-01-2011 22:17    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dingo667 wrote:
rynner2 wrote:
Frankly, I can't believe that two other astronauts have happily left Armstrong and Aldrin claiming to have been the first men to land on the moon if it wasn't true.

In fact, it's fecking ridiculous! Twisted Evil

Shhhh Rynner, shhhh....deep breath...better Wink

I'm not angry, just feckin' exasperated that this nonsense continues!

For me, the Moon landings are a rock-solid part of history. I've already given my reasons, earlier in this thread.
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Dingo667Offline
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PostPosted: 28-01-2011 13:45    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good for you. If I were in your shoes and it winds you up, I'd skip this thread for health reasons. I know that I skip threads that I have nothing to add to. Seriously. However others do have the right to go on with this 'nonsense' if they wish or is it "Rynner has spoken and knows the truth so everyone shut up and close this thread?"
I know that I am still interested.
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Bigfoot73Offline
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PostPosted: 28-01-2011 17:13    Post subject: Reply with quote

It isn't just Rynner who has spoken , it's most posters on this thread, he does know the truth, which is that Apollo 11 was not hoaxed, and if you are going to post on this thread why not just say what still interests you about the hoax theory?
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Dingo667Offline
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PostPosted: 29-01-2011 13:03    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am not 'allowed' to have my own opinion? Close the fecking thread then, why is it still open? Should have a stamp on it: Mystery Solved!

I' also like to suggest another thread: Things I may discuss and others that I may not
Can those that know everything please make me a list of topics that you feel are worthy of my interest please, as I am clearly not capable to do so by myself.

As the above is clearly sarcasm, may I also suggest that those to whom this topic is 100% explained to stop reading this thread as it clearly doesn't give you any new information and seems to just raise your blood pressure.

I can feel your frustration, I was there myself when it comes to various topics [orbs, chemtrails, chinese lanterns being UFOs etc] but when I can see that I can't change someone else's mind I usually just remove myself from the issue, as I still believe that everyone is entitled to their own opinion.

As said before, the reason I am not finished with the Moonlandings yet is that I am personally not 100% happy with the explanations given. That doesn't mean I can't change my mind. However that will only happen when I feel that all the info makes sense to my own self.

I will also ignore this thread for the time being, because there are no new things to discuss.. snore
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Bigfoot73Offline
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PostPosted: 29-01-2011 14:37    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
why is it still open?


If it wasn't for you and Dannycheveaux this thread would have remained dormant, and Rynner and me would have been quite happy to leave it so.

Quote:
I' also like to suggest another thread: Things I may discuss and others that I may not


"Things I'm only threatening to discuss and others I haven't actually thought about at all" might be a more appropriate title.


Quote:
As the above is clearly sarcasm, may I also suggest that those to whom this topic is 100% explained to stop reading this thread as it clearly doesn't give you any new information and seems to just raise your blood pressure.


We had stopped reading this thread, It isn't giving us any new information mainly because there isn't any, and if there is anything you might like to introduce I'm sure we will be only too happy to debunk that too.

Quote:
I will also ignore this thread for the time being, because there are no new things to discuss..

I will be doing much the same , seeing as you haven't raised anything new to discuss. There isn't anything new to discuss. There are too many perpetual circular Fortean debates as it is and I don't want to see this become one of them.
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dannycheveaux1Offline
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PostPosted: 29-01-2011 17:05    Post subject: Reply with quote

Those highly detailed images of the moon from Orbiter certainly are impressive and even beautiful. The ones showing the Apollo landing sites are really interesting and go a long way to proving it DID happen
After all, NASA wouldn't fake photos would they?

"The whole Moon hoax story started because some of the photos very probably were faked"

Ah sorry BF, maybe they would then...
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Bigfoot73Offline
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PostPosted: 29-01-2011 17:28    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
After all, NASA wouldn't fake photos would they?

"The whole Moon hoax story started because some of the photos very probably were faked"

Ah sorry BF, maybe they would then...


The photos of the Apollo 11 lander and the astronauts, not the photos of the lunar landscape, East Crater, which wasn't in the schedule, or indeed any of the photos from any other Apollo mission.

They faked the photos because it was expedient to do so, they didn't fake the mission. I've said this before, several times. Nobody has ever proposed a convincing reason for them having to fake the mission, at least one which could apply to Apollo 11 yet not the subsequent missions. Said that before too.
Unless of course you would care to enlighten me Danny.
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sherbetbizarreOffline
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PostPosted: 17-12-2013 00:49    Post subject: Reply with quote

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One of the Films on This Year's Black List is an Alternate History of Stanley Kubrick Faking the Moon Landing

On Monday, this year's Black List—the annual list of the best unproduced scripts in Hollywood as voted on by over 250 studio executives—was announced via Twitter. This list features 72 titles, six fewer than last year's. Previous Black Lists have included what would become three of the last five Best Picture Academy Award winners: Argo, The King's Speech, and Slumdog Millionaire. Being on the list gives your script roughly a 120 percent higher chance of getting made into a feature film by a studio than if it were an average unproduced script.

One of the screenplays inducted onto this year's Black List (check out the complete list here) is by self-described "newbie" Stephany Folsom, and is intriguingly titled, 1969: A Space Odyssey or How Kubrick Learned to Stop Worrying and Land on the Moon (an obvious reference to both the title of Stanley Kubrick's classic black-comedy satire from 1964, and to the director's 2001: A Space Odyssey from 1968).

Folsom's 108-page script (a drama) focuses on "Barbara," a lone wolf working in the publicity department at NASA's office in Washington, DC, in 1969. The story is an alternate history of how, as the Cold War rages, Barbara reaches out to and convinces acclaimed director Stanley Kubrick to work with NASA to fake the moon and one-up the Soviets.

"Hijinks ensue," Folsom says.

The film is partly inspired by the famous conspiracy theory that Kubrick was recruited by the US government to direct a fake moon landing. "I'm a big conspiracy fan," Folsom tells Mother Jones. "Now, I don't necessarily believe in conspiracy theories—but I liked the idea."

Folsom is a 29-year-old, Los Angeles-based screenwriter, hailing from Colorado Springs. As a writer and filmmaker, she cites Lou Reed, Steven Soderbergh, Kurt Vonnegut, Jean Renoir, John Hughes, and (of course) Kubrick as some of her biggest influences. Before her career as a screenwriter, she was a journalist and then a documentarian, making films on, as she puts it, "uplifting things like the AIDS crisis and human trafficking." 1969 is the first script of hers to get circulated in Hollywood. She got the news of her inclusion on the Black List today while she was staring at her smart phone, checking Twitter.

In crafting this script, Folsom not only drew from her knowledge as a huge Kubrick fan, but her interests as a NASA buff and space nerd. (She reserves special praise for the "amazing" Kubrick exhibit at the Los Angeles County Museum of Art, and the "really fun" NASA Socials.) Folsom's Barbara is a composite character based on two women involved in the Presidential Task Force on Women's Rights and Responsibilities during the Nixon administration. (The task force was dedicated to increasing the presence of women in American government.)

As for which actors Folsom would want to portray Barbara and Kubrick in a film version of her alternate history, she says she really isn't sure. And as for who would be her dream director, she is keeping mum about it.

Here's the log line for her script:

    In 1969, a strong-willed female in a male dominated workplace is tasked with getting the world's most temperamental director, Stanley Kubrick, to pull off the greatest con of all time.

LINK
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Bigfoot73Offline
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PostPosted: 17-12-2013 03:31    Post subject: Reply with quote

So first the conspiracists claim the films and stills were faked, pointing to numerous alleged giveaway glitches and goofs, then they would have us believe they were all made by Kubrick. Ed Wood maybe, but Kubrick?
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Anome_Offline
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PostPosted: 17-12-2013 09:21    Post subject: Reply with quote

No, what you don't realise is that 2001: A Space Odyssey was actually filmed in space and on the moon. That's why the low gravity effects are so realistic.

So when he had to fake it for NASA, of course it looked less convincing.
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dannycheveaux1Offline
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PostPosted: 17-12-2013 11:38    Post subject: Reply with quote

See, I for one was willing to let this topic lie but it just refuses!
I've heard the rumour before about Kubrick and of course he's not around now to deny it. If it was stage managed then someone had to do it! But Hollywood has produced films based on conspiracy myths as "true" before of course, incl MIB, Battle of LA - not necessarily to be taken seriously and most notably in this case, Capricorn One.

For me, among some of the questions that remain are:

Photo anomalies of course (incl artificial light sources, exactly the same backdrops in separate missions)

Van Allen Belt - no human (apart from Apollo) has ever attempted to travel through it

The manned moon landings only took place during one of the US government's most insidious periods (Nixon's presidency)

The destruction or misplacing of plans and equipment used for the Apollo missions (How the hell did we get to the moon 40 years ago? - Who knows but we did!) and lost or dubious samples of moon rock. Is this the only field in human history where our technological ability has gone backwards?

Personally I think IF it was a conspiracy, then all the manned landing missions were faked, the spacecraft remaining in close proximity to earth, signals being manipulated as needed. Apollo 13's problems may or may not have been staged to rekindle the public's interest

I honestly do WANT to believe we went to the moon and returned safely 6 times but I don't know what it would take to convince me and others that it happened 100%.
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