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SwiftyOffline
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PostPosted: 12-05-2014 21:52    Post subject: Reply with quote

Doesn't look good for Rolf at all Crying or Very sad
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stunevilleOffline
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PostPosted: 13-05-2014 06:52    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thread closed pending re-organisation. See this post for more info.

edit - reopened.
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escargot1Offline
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PostPosted: 13-05-2014 08:57    Post subject: Reply with quote

Stuart Hall is back in court -

Stuart Hall Shuns Witness Box In Abuse Trial


Quote:
Veteran broadcaster Stuart Hall has declined to give evidence at his rape trial.

The 84-year-old is accused of repeatedly raping two teenage girls in the 1970s.

The jury at Preston Crown Court were told that they could draw their own conclusions about why Hall has chosen not to enter the witness box.

They have previously been told that Hall does not dispute that he had sex with the two alleged victims but maintains it was consensual.

The two women, now in their 40s and 50s, told the court last week about the alleged abuse.


Hall seems to have been advised to keep his mouth shut after calling his first accusers liars and then being convicted of assaulting them.

Another local presenter is back in court on 27th May on various sexual assault charges: TV weatherman Fred Talbot pleads not guilty to child sex charges

Quote:
TV weather presenter Fred Talbot has pleaded not guilty to nine counts of indecent assault and of one serious sexual assault.

The 64-year-old from Bowdon, Greater Manchester, is alleged to have committed the offences between 1968 and 1983 when he was a teacher.

Four of the alleged victims attended Altrincham Grammar School for Boys and one was at Elgin High in Newcastle.


Hall and Talbot are household names up here. To hear of Hall being accused and calling the accusers liars, and then seeing him convicted, is something that just couldn't have happened years ago, for the same reasons as Savile got away with it.
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PeteByrdieOffline
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PostPosted: 13-05-2014 11:14    Post subject: Reply with quote

Stuart Hall and Rolf Harris are among the celebrities who defined my early childhood. I didn't want to believe it of either of them. How much longer can this go on for? Is it representative of the amount of abuse in the population in general, or an indication of how many people given admiration will stop thinking about the effects their actions have on the feelings of others?
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OneWingedBirdOffline
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PostPosted: 13-05-2014 15:22    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not sure, but tbh I could never quite reconcile the reported rates of molestation (which drift around 1 in 5 for girls and 1 in 12 for boys) with the alleged prevalence of paedo's in the population. which is supposed to be around 0.01%

One supposes the ones that get convicted are the tip of the iceberg, but how big is the rest of it?
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CochiseOffline
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PostPosted: 14-05-2014 08:29    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you are going to analyse it properly you also need to break it down into two or three categories. In the US they tend to consider everyone under 21 as a 'child' when it comes to sexual matters. That is not only far from universal - there are many countries where anywhere between 14 and 16 is considered an acceptable age for sexual intercourse - it is also far too simplistic.

A male who seduces a 15 year-old well developed girl or a mature female who encourages a hormonally-rampant 15 year old boy is likely to have radically different motivations and sexual tastes to someone who rapes an 8 year old child or molests an infant.

I dislike the term paedophile for that exact reason - it sweeps up far too many things together and in my mind should be reserved for those who are attracted to pre-pubescent children.
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MadameTrunkoOffline
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PostPosted: 14-05-2014 12:13    Post subject: Reply with quote

On the conspiracy front… for what it's worth, I've come across a good number of far-right cranks claiming that this is all to distract us from Muslim grooming gangs. Case in point:

http://sarahmaidofalbion.blogspot.co.uk/2012/11/in-search-of-equivalence.html

Quote:
Experience has taught me never to accept anything I read in the papers or see on the TV at face value, and never, under any circumstances to assume that what I am being told is the full and unvarnished truth.

This is even more the case with high profile stories which dominate the news day after day and often week after week.

In much of the West, where truth and honour were once held to be so precious, journalism long ago ceased to be about accurately reporting news and instead has become more about creating a narrative, promoting an agenda or in many cases a means of suppressing or misrepresenting real events.

For that reason, in the current environment, the most appropriate response to anything the news media tells us is to ask three questions:
Why are they telling me this?
Is it true?
What are they seeking to achieve?
In recent weeks with the exception of a few days of US election coverage (of which I will have more to say in a future posting) the news has been dominated, virtually to the expense of all else, by stories of long ago child abuse, most of it occurring thirty, forty or even fifty years ago.

None of this is exactly topical, in the first case the main suspect is now dead, and his accusers middle aged women, all recalling events in the 1960’s and 70’s. The secondary suspects are old and diminished men, their fame a distant recollection even for their most argent fans, their alleged crimes historical events from another time.

Yes, some were one famous, and yes,if true, this may be a news story, but the main news story?, on every broadcast?, night after night, week after week?. At a time when so much is going on, this is all we hear about?

The second story now appears to have been no story at all but an exercise in massive media fantasy wish fulfilment which fell apart in a mess of lies, false identifications and a flawed liberal, narrative always too eager to accuse rich and powerful white men of heinous acts and exploitation.

The second case has certainly gone very wrong for the BBC, whilst other media outlets, such a s channel four now rush to distance themselves from their earlier breathless reporting of the allegations.

Although under British law, proof of guilt is not predicated upon the number of people who make the same allegation, it does appear there may be some truth to what is said about Jimmy Saville, however, it is now clear that the allegations about poor old Lord MacAlpine are entirely false.

However, even if they has all been true, why were the decades old crimes of dead men and thirty year old allegations against long ago retired politicians the most important news story of the day, for weeks on end, now, all these years later in 2012?

The latest of the allegations may present some clues to what is going on. The, also very dead, heavy set politician Cyril Smith has been posthumously accused of spanking bare bottomed schoolboys during the 1960’s (Such allegations are, of course, all but impossible to prove 50 years later, and in any event according to the Beano, being spanked was an occupational hazard for schoolboys back in the 1960s). Like Jimmy Saville, Mr Smith is no longer here to defend himself, and, therefore, as the matter will never come to court, just about anything can be alleged.

The media claims that the rumours about Smith have been around for years, but that is what we are told about all the accused, and, of course, there are rumours about most public figures, so why have they all come out now?

Cyril Smith, of course, was the member of Parliament for, …. guess where? …. he was MP for Rochdale. Rochdale, of course was in the news earlier this year when a gang of Muslim men were convicted of grooming, raping, abusing and prostituting a large number of under aged white girls. Now isn’t that a coincidence?

Are you starting to get the picture?

There is one very obvious reason that old news and lurid, unproven, and probably unprovable allegations of child abuse by old white men have been dominating the news since September, the media are in search of equivalence.

You can be sure that there are a number of big cases about to hit the courts featuring Muslim males and little white girls, so the press are desperate for news stories about the host community doing the same thing, even very old, and very dubious stories.

Can anyone be in doubt that were a group of immigrants to be found committing acts of cannibalism the main news reports the next day would be about Sawney Bean and the legends of Scottish cannibal clans in 1500 AD.

All this nonsense is the smoke screen which will enable the media to say “look, white men do it too!”


OF course, this kind of thing is generally just people reading their own personal obsessions into the news.
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Heckler20Offline
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PostPosted: 14-05-2014 12:59    Post subject: Reply with quote

MadameTrunko wrote:

OF course, this kind of thing is generally just people reading their own personal obsessions into the news.


And incorrect about Cyril Smith, Private Eye were printing allegations about him as far back as 1979, allegations he didn't challenge at the time or subsequently whilst alive.
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CochiseOffline
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PostPosted: 15-05-2014 09:32    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Muslim abuse gangs do exist, though, and equally were not taken seriously for a long time. For goodness sake, its not a competition where the 'winner' gets prosecuted and everyone else gets a free pass.

There are Muslim grooming gangs (or maybe that should read 'gangs of Muslims who are grooming victims). They should be investigated and, if sufficient evidence is forthcoming, be prosecuted. There are celebrities who have abused their position. They should be investigated and if sufficient evidence is forthcoming, be prosecuted.

The media should give equivalent coverage to trials and verdicts of both. Anything else is political posturing, and highly offensive given the damage sexual abuse does to the victim. Our media simply seem incapable any more of separating truth and spin - indeed they seem to actively indulge in deliberate manipulation every bit as much as politicians - both wonder why no-one believes them and increasingly extreme and absurd views become popular. Sooner or later there is bound to be a reaction - I'm just hoping its not some form of compulsory state-enforced new puritanism of either the left or the right, or, even worse, of a religion.

Yuk, I hate people. (Present company excepted Smile )
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Quake42Offline
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PostPosted: 15-05-2014 09:50    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The Muslim abuse gangs do exist, though, and equally were not taken seriously for a long time. For goodness sake, its not a competition where the 'winner' gets prosecuted and everyone else gets a free pass.

There are Muslim grooming gangs (or maybe that should read 'gangs of Muslims who are grooming victims). They should be investigated and, if sufficient evidence is forthcoming, be prosecuted. There are celebrities who have abused their position. They should be investigated and if sufficient evidence is forthcoming, be prosecuted.



Precisely.

The grooming gangs have been around since the 80s and until recently police and prosecutors wouldn't touch the issue with a bargepole. The rise of the BNP in the north west in the early 2000s was largely down to this problem. Further to the Right's conspiracy theories, the police decided to demand a documentary be shelved and to prosecute Nick Griffin for talking about the problem - rather than, you know, arresting the rapists.

So the far right's paranoia on this is not entirely without foundation, although as Heckler says they have missed the point on Cyril Smith.

I do suspect that the negative media coverage of the CPS's failure to tackle the grooming gangs, particularly in the North West, may have been a factor in their decision to take some extremely iffy celeb cases to court (Le Vell, Roache, Evans).
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MonstrosaOffline
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PostPosted: 16-05-2014 07:08    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ex Scarborough mayor Peter Jaconelli stripped of honours I'm sorry Blobfish I think you look like Mr Jaconelli, again I'm sorry.
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rynner2Offline
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PostPosted: 22-05-2014 14:45    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ex-Radio 1 DJ Chris Denning charged with 41 sex offences

Former BBC Radio 1 DJ Chris Denning is to be charged with 41 sexual offences, the Crown Prosecution Service has said.
The alleged offences, dating from 1967 to 1985, are related to 22 boys aged nine to 16.
Mr Denning was one of the original Radio 1 team when the station was launched in 1967.
He was initially arrested under Operation Yewtree in June 2013 and will appear at Westminster Magistrates' Court on Friday.

Mr Denning was also the first announcer heard on BBC Radio 2 when the channel took to the air in 1964.
He worked as a music producer for The Beatles and ran his own music and video production business.

Baljit Ubhey, London chief crown prosecutor, said: "The decision to prosecute has been taken in accordance with the Code for Crown Prosecutors and Crown Prosecution Service legal guidance on rape and child sexual abuse.
"We have determined that there is sufficient evidence for a realistic prospect of conviction and that a prosecution is in the public interest."

Prosecutors found that there was not enough evidence to prosecute in connection with three further alleged victims

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-27525751
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rynner2Offline
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PostPosted: 22-05-2014 14:53    Post subject: Reply with quote

Swifty wrote:
Doesn't look good for Rolf at all Crying or Very sad

The latest evidence (from Australia) is pretty sordid.

Rolf Harris 'told mother her teen liked him groping her'

...

Speaking via video link, the mother and daughter, from Australia, described the defendant as a "dirty old man".

...

The alleged assault does not form part of the formal charges against Mr Harris, of Bray, Berkshire, because it took place outside the UK at a time before foreign incidents could be tried in British courts.

etc...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-27514499
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MythopoeikaOffline
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PostPosted: 22-05-2014 17:28    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh dear. Sad
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theyithianOffline
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PostPosted: 22-05-2014 17:51    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think people want to see endless updates of every sordid paedo-trial posted here. There are countless other mainstream news-providers who will supply this stuff. Is it possible to limit posts and links to the conspiracy angle (where one exists)?
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